The Official Referee Thread

[Red Devil]

Avram Grant faces a disrepute charge after claiming ref Steve Bennett helped Manchester United win the Premier League. Bennett oversaw United’s 2-0 title clincher at Wigan on Sunday but Chelsea boss Grant said: “In England there are very good referees but some you can influence.” Ref Bennett failed to award Wigan a penalty for a Rio Ferdinand handball but later gave United a spot-kick from which they scored. He also did not send off United midfielder Paul Scholes for a second foul on Wilson Palacios.

Grant raged: “I believe in the tradition of the fair English game. I will not say anything against it. But what happened is what I expected. “Paul Scholes should have been shown a red card and Wigan awarded a penalty.” Asked if he is glad an English ref will not oversee the Champions League final, Grant said: “I can say it like this – yes.”

I would point out that this article is written by arch United hater reporter from the Sun newspaper. As for Grant's comments - he could end up in court if Steve Bennett decides legal action is relevant.

[manutd004]

Avram Grant faces a disrepute charge after claiming ref Steve Bennett helped Manchester United win the Premier League.

Neither Grant nor the Journalist must of watched our other games that were refereed by Steve Bennett :rolleyes:

[versa]

Just came across an infuriating article that first gave me this idea of starting this thread. [Edit: Just saw that RD has posted it in the newsroom too.]

I don't think there is any official thread on referees in this forum yet, in which we can debate, discuss or just slag referees' style or performance from games that involved us to other games not concerning us. An innovative idea, I hope.

Besides, some of you may not be aware that we have at least 2 members in our midst that are actually qualified referees ie Safc Cjl and Cappy. Their inputs in this thread would be most interesting to say the least, especially in those controversial decisions made in some high-stake games.

And of course, commenting on referees here in a football forum would absolve us from being charged by the FA for bringing the game into disrepute.

Think these 2 related articles can kick off this thread...



Daily Express


REF FIXED TITLE FOR FERGIE

AVRAM GRANT last night made the astonishing accusation that referee Steve Bennett had bent to Sir Alex Ferguson’s will – and handed Manchester United the title.

The Chelsea manager’s explosive claims will anger United boss Ferguson and spark a war of words between them in what is now set to be a highly-charged build-up to the Champions League final next week in Moscow.

Grant was angered by Ferguson’s normal mind games from back page before last Sunday’s title showdown games. Chelsea could only draw with Bolton, who had been fired up by Ferguson’s jibes that they had been out celebrating.

United, meanwhile, won comfortably 2-0 at Wigan to take the title by two points and Grant last night remarkably accused Bennett of going easy on the Old Trafford team, appearing to question his integrity.

Grant believes Wigan should have had a penalty when Rio Ferdinand “handled” and that Paul Scholes should have been sent off for a second bookable offence.

He said: “The referee was, as expected, good for one team. What happened is what I expected. In England there are some very good referees. But there are some, a few of them, you can influence. Like we saw.

“The game we played against United at Old Trafford where we lost 2-0, the referee changed the result there for sure. The red card for Mikel John Obi in that game was not a red card. The red card that wasn’t for Paul Scholes on Sunday should have been. Then there was the penalty.

“I do not think the world is against Chelsea. But there were some coincidences for Manchester United. But I congratulate them.”

Grant’s words are bound to provoke a stinging response from Ferguson – and could also land the Chelsea coach in hot water with the FA, who do not take kindly to their officials being accused of partiality.

Asked if he was pleased that an English referee will not be in charge in Moscow, Grant said: “I can say it like this – yes.”

His words echo the spiky conspiracy theories of his predecessor Jose Mourinho.

And just like Mourinho before last season’s FA Cup final, he goes into this next game, the biggest in Chelsea’s history, with his future shrouded in mystery.

Grant believes he should be allowed to carry on whatever happens in Russia, but he has received no assurances from owner Roman Abramovich.

They are due to meet this week, and the coach said: “I find it strange that my future is under discussion. The club will ask me if I want to continue. I’ll make it very, very easy. I have a contract for four years, a contract between friends.”



Vital Football


Avram Rant - Bizarre To Say The Least!

Avram Grant blames the referees for his own failure. A familiar theme: it must be some kind of Chelsea legacy now.

The manager believes referees played a major part in United's success - but of course conveniently forgetting about the occasions when his was favoured by contentious decisions.

'In England there are some very good referees - but there are some, a few of them, you can influence,' he said. Probably Terry told him who were the ones you can influence - he's an expert at this.

'I think that in the game we played against United at Old Trafford the referee changed the result for sure. We know that. The red card for Mikel was not a red card.

'There should have been a red card for Scholes on Sunday. Then there was the penalty but it's finished. I congratulate United.

'I do not think the world is against Chelsea, or English football, but in this case there were some coincidences for Manchester United.'

Grant is obviously suffering from serious memory disorder. He forgot to mention that in that certain game at Old Trafford, Chelsea should have been down to 10 men much earlier when Joe Cole had fouled Evra as the last man inside the box. And of course the same players' bone-crunching, nasty tackle on Ronaldo should have earned a red - yet Cole was allowed to stay on.

Then of course Grant forgot to mention that Steve Bennett had not awarded us a blatant penalty at Wigan when Scholes had been fouled. And his conspiracy theory is unperturbed by the fact that the title race should never have gone down to the last day.

Why? Well, let's have a look. We've dropped to points at Middlesbrough not least because we were denied a blatant penalty for a handball by Taylor. Then Rob Styles' turn came at Blackburn: United should have had no less than three spot-kicks - one for a challenge on Rooney, one for a bad tackle from behind on Ronaldo and one for a handball by Emerton. He gave none of them.

And Grant is overlooking his side triumph over us: or at least he's overlooking the fact that the referee's decisions played no small part in that victory: two horrible offside decisions against Giggs and Ronaldo, then Ronaldo got wrestled to the floor by Ballack yet there was no penalty. And then Wiley awarded a penalty for a handball that was as far from deliberate as it can be... but Chelsea managers never allow the facts to stand in the way of a little conspiracy theory, do they?

I know it's all part of the mind games and that his target is to influence the referee of the Champions League final. But Avram, let me give you an advice: take a leaf out of Benitez's book and focus on training and coaching your team. The world will be a much better place.



So what do you think? Has some refereeing decisions helped us unwittingly towards retaining our crown? Or do you think we are often victimised instead because of what and who we are?

[akash_reds]

he is just a sore loser!! :rolleyes:

[Red Devil]

The reporter, Curtis, is a well known Arsenal fan and United hater. He is so biased he leans to one side.

[eoininho]

shut up grant! you're gettin sacked in the morning DEAL WITH IT!!

[versa]

Just out of curiosity and purely for entertainment only, and that it represents your own personal opinion only, which referees do you, over time and observation, deemed as 'anti-United'? For example, seemingly unwilling or seldom rule 50-50 situation in our favour?

[Red Devil]

I have no real interest in referees as far as any alleged bias is concerned. I try and be positive. The Bristol City v Palace game (play offs) I watched the other night has, I believe, Webb in charge. He was excellent and ran the game beautifully. He is a big lad who stands no nonsense. Good to watch.

Using the phrased "ref was bent, or biased" is just an excuse to look elsewhere for shortcomings in one's own team. Referee's are only people, they do not wear red capes and blue knickers!

The best ref in the world was Collina, and he said he often made errors of judgement; the difference was that players and fans accepted him 100%.

If I were Steve Bennett, I would seriously consider legal action against Grant for his comments.

[versa]

I have no real interest in referees as far as any alleged bias is concerned. I try and be positive. The Bristol City v Palace game (play offs) I watched the other night has, I believe, Webb in charge. He was excellent and ran the game beautifully. He is a big lad who stands no nonsense. Good to watch.

Using the phrased "ref was bent, or biased" is just an excuse to look elsewhere for shortcomings in one's own team. Referee's are only people, they do not wear red capes and blue knickers!

The best ref in the world was Collina, and he said he often made errors of judgement; the difference was that players and fans accepted him 100%.

If I were Steve Bennett, I would seriously consider legal action against Grant for his comments.

Know what you mean. But this is not a witch-hunting thread to target any particular referee or to doubt his professionalism.

It is just a thread for members to moan, whine, debate, discuss or to vent their frustrations at some controversial decisions made in a game.. without being charged by the FA for bringing the game to disrepute.

Perhaps it will come alive when there are games?

[Cappy]

as a referee, i could probably go on for hours in this thread, but ill try to limit it for your reading concerns...the biggest problem in today's game at ALL levels when it comes down to referees is communication, not just on the pitch but off of it...players and coaches have to face the media after they have a nightmare of a game, so they see it as unfair when referees make a horrid decision and then drift back into their respected lives almost seeming like they are not held accountable for actions or lack thereof...there needs to be better dialogs between coaches/players and referees not just during the game but after

[Red Devil]

Perhaps it will come alive when there are games? As the pharoah said to his Mummy!

[versa]

as a referee, i could probably go on for hours in this thread, but ill try to limit it for your reading concerns...the biggest problem in today's game at ALL levels when it comes down to referees is communication, not just on the pitch but off of it...players and coaches have to face the media after they have a nightmare of a game, so they see it as unfair when referees make a horrid decision and then drift back into their respected lives almost seeming like they are not held accountable for actions or lack thereof...there needs to be better dialogs between coaches/players and referees not just during the game but after

Referees do talk differently from other members.. ;)

Just had a brilliant idea (I hope). Perhaps you can do it when you are so very free and have nothing else better to do [:D] - tell us some common misconceptions of football rules or even some myths about referees and games that only you are privileged to come to know?

And of course you will come in handy when there are actual games with controversial decisons given.

Thanks.

:)

P.S. RD, see? This thread can actually be so interesting. ;)

[versa]

Skysports
By Adrian Curtis, PA Sport


Chelsea boss quizzed over Steve Bennett comments

The Football Association have written to Chelsea coach Avram Grant to ask him to explain his remarks about referee Steve Bennett.

Grant called Bennett's integrity into question after Manchester United's 2-0 win at Wigan last Sunday earned a tenth Premier League title for Sir Alex Ferguson.

Chelsea, level on points with United before kick-off, could only draw at home with Bolton.

But Bennett came under fire for not awarding Wigan a penalty for handball and then opting not to send off Paul Scholes for a second bookable offence when he fouled Wilson Palacios.

At his Champions League media conference on Wednesday Grant said: "I told you that I believed in the tradition of the fair English game. I will not say anything against it. But what happened is what I expected.

"In England there are very good referees, but there are some - a few that you can influence, like you saw.

"I think in our game against Manchester United at Old Trafford, the referee (Mike Dean) influenced the result for sure. We know that.

"I think the red card for Mikel John Obi in that game should not have been a red card, I think that Paul Scholes should have had a red card on Sunday and Wigan a penalty also. But it is finished. I congratulate Manchester United."

Grant has until May 28 to reply.

[Jazz 16]

as a referee, i could probably go on for hours in this thread, but ill try to limit it for your reading concerns...the biggest problem in today's game at ALL levels when it comes down to referees is communication, not just on the pitch but off of it...players and coaches have to face the media after they have a nightmare of a game, so they see it as unfair when referees make a horrid decision and then drift back into their respected lives almost seeming like they are not held accountable for actions or lack thereof...there needs to be better dialogs between coaches/players and referees not just during the game but after

great post Cappy.
I like most fans have a strange view of refs. you love them one week
and cant stand them the next. I have a bad habit of buying football books when
going through airports. I have a new found interest in the life of a referee.
I have the Jeff Winter book and Collini (best ref ever) book waiting to be read.
Ill get stuck into them and come back with the findings :D

anyway Cappy, feel free 'to go on for hours' if you like. Myself and some
others tend to 'go on for hours' on here, so feel free to do the same.:p

[sparkic]

Excuses, excuses, & excuses...my god his nearly as bad as those Scousers! If those yanks want to replace Rafa they so should get Grant! He will certainly not have and fans against him as they all love to make lame, petty, and pathetic excuses. This is the trademark of bad and sore losers and that is exactly what Chelsea are doing - particularly Grant. I just hope we win the CL final fair and square in 90 mins while playing the best football we can so they cannot have anymore excuses.

[cjl_safcfan]

sore loser, it is very very rarely a referee will be in favour of one team...although it often seems like it.
i often feel let down by referees, but i know it isnt an easy job. any viewers have unlimited replays, a referee has a second to decide... not always right, but makes the fairest result possible in the time he has. it is then down to the players, managers and everyone watching top accept it.

p.s, im on a new keyboard...please excuse any typos/spelling errors in the next few weeks/days

[versa]

To start some ball rolling, so who do the members think is the best and the worst referee in EPL? Webb on one end and Clattenburg the other?

[cjl_safcfan]

dont really know...i dont pay attention to whp the referee is, but i pay attention to how well they do

[versa]

dont really know...i dont pay attention to whp the referee is, but i pay attention to how well they do

:rolleyes: So who has impressed you so much that you happened to know his name and who appalled you so much that you happened to know his name? :D

[Jazz 16]

To start some ball rolling, so who do the members think is the best and the worst referee in EPL? Webb on one end and Clattenburg the other?

It's strange you think Clattenburg is so poor. He is one of the best young refs
around imo. Ok this season he has made a few high profile errors
(which will happen in EVERY ref's career) but he still commands respect and does
a great job the majority of the time.
Versa-maybe you put Clattenburg there because he 'wronged' United?

Howard Webb is a top ref though. He's a copper as well, which helps him I think.
Chris Foy isn't too bad either and I rated Atkinson until he gave us nothing
against Pompey:rolleyes:

[versa]

It's strange you think Clattenburg is so poor. He is one of the best young refs
around imo. Ok this season he has made a few high profile errors
(which will happen in EVERY ref's career) but he still commands respect and does
a great job the majority of the time.
Versa-maybe you put Clattenburg there because he 'wronged' United?

Howard Webb is a top ref though. He's a copper as well, which helps him I think.
Chris Foy isn't too bad either and I rated Atkinson until he gave us nothing
against Pompey:rolleyes:

Both reasons are correct. :p

Seriously, I am no expert in this field; I am actually looking to Cappy and Cjl for some expert opinions especially after some controversial games or just generally speaking, and to hear some general feedbacks from members.

Or simply put, just a layman wanting some 'action' on referees after all the discussion on players, which after a while, you find yourself repeating your views on a certain player on different occasions only. Lol. :D

Perhaps when there are actual games or some general myths and misconceptions etc would be nice read.

[cjl_safcfan]

like i said, i dont look at who, but how well...
but in my refereeing course, constant references were made to clattenburg as inspirational, starting at 14 in the north east, working his way up to the fifa register, i dont think he could have got that far without being a good referee

[versa]

like i said, i dont look at who, but how well...
but in my refereeing course, constant references were made to clattenburg as inspirational, starting at 14 in the north east, working his way up to the fifa register, i dont think he could have got that far without being a good referee

Oh!! :eek: Ok... I will pay more attention to referees when the season starts again. ;)