[dlan4327]

Actim is extremely biased in my opinion. Basically the Actim index is heavily, heavily

biased towards players who score heaps of goals. A goal is worth 4 points for a striker,

5 points for a midfielder & 6 points for a defender/goalkeeper. An assist is 3 points.

However Actim doesn't reward outstanding defensive play, like last ditch tackles or

blocks. It doesn't reward a Carrick or Flamini for covering miles of ground in an

energetic display of defensive coverage. All defensive midfielders and defenders get a

raw deal compared to strikers and attacking midfielders. A goalkeeper has to make

three saves to get a single lousy point!

[reddwarf]

I've just realised that the ranking redkhoon used is from 29th April.

Between 29th April and 6th May, Santa Cruz went from being the 5th best player in the Premiership to the 3rd best player in the Premiership. During that time Blackburn played 1 game and Santa Cruz scored 2...against Derby.

Sorry but that just makes a mockery of those stats for me.

[Nemanjaaa]

Carrick is sheer class and has been fantastic for us this seaosn no arguments.

[redkhoon]

I think there a few flaws in it. Nevertheless its still the most accurate way of measuring a players performance. Its an overall ranking. Now according actim santa cruz ( in addition to scoring heaps of goals) he contributes alot in other areas. so does that not make him a better all round team player than torres? yes torres has more goals, but that does not make him the better player. Its not bisaed. Do you know how many goals rooney has scored in the league this year? and guess what number he is in actim? 11.in overall rankings.Why? because it has recognised, his hard work, as a tackler, a ball winner, a passer, assists etc. My point was Carrick is not united quality.

[reddwarf]

Originally Posted by redkhoon

I think there a few flaws in it. Nevertheless its still the most accurate way of measuring a players performance. Its an overall ranking. Now according actim santa cruz ( in addition to scoring heaps of goals) he contributes alot in other areas. so does that not make him a better all round team player than torres? yes torres has more goals, but that does not make him the better player. Its not bisaed. Do you know how many goals rooney has scored in the league this year? and guess what number he is in actim? 11.in overall rankings.Why? because it has recognised, his hard work, as a tackler, a ball winner, a passer, assists etc. My point was Carrick is not united quality.

Then the debate to be had is what is better - a striker that works hard for the team like Kuyt or a poacher that contributes little other than goals like Van Nistelrooy. But that's a debate for a whole other thread

If you say Carrick is not United quality but the Actim Index says he is our 9th best player this season then does that mean the vast majority of our squad is not good enough?

[redkhoon]

well reddwraf id be really worried if he wasnt even in the top 11 performers at united, given that we're only allowed 11 so start with! imagine he was 12th best in a team of 11?

[reddwarf]

Originally Posted by redkhoon

well reddwraf id be really worried if he wasnt even in the top 11 performers at united, given that we're only allowed 11 so start with! imagine he was 12th best in a team of 11?

Lol. Yeah true!

But on 29th April there were only 10 United players in the top 100...

1 Ronaldo
8 Tevez
12 Rooney
16 Rio
20 Brown
34 Evra
49 Vidic
50 VDS
70 Carrick
84 Giggs

What about Scholes, Anderson, Park and Hargreaves? Do you rate them?

Don't get me wrong. You have every right to your opinion that Carrick isn't United quality. I'm just arguing that you shouldn't base it on the Actim Index!

[manutd004]

Reddwarf's arguments I 100% agree with.

Also, if Carrick was at a team like Tottenham say, he would be a lot higher than he is. But playing for a club like United, you may say its easier to play well, but playing next to players like Rooney, Tevez, Ronaldo, Scholes etc they are obviously going to be our most recognised players because they are the most attacking, and the best players in the team.

But Carrick has been fantastic this season imo. I'm glad he plays for us, and the only reason he doesn't get in the England squad is because hes not "high-profile enough" such as Lampard, Gerrard etc

And also, he plays well in the big games for the person who said he gets caught out at the top level.

And also, if he is our 9th best performer, then surely he deserves to be in the starting 11!

[Jamie69]

For me personally carrick should be no more than a squad player. I dont hate him but i dont think he is worth what we paid for him. I get frustrated watching him, its like watching slow motion, but thats just his style. He has been okay this season, but for me hargo and anderson offer more than carrick.

[redkhoon]

of course i rate them. scholsey is one of my fave utd players. and a legend. but actim is not measuring whether he is united legend. or if he's my fave player. but rather his performances THIS SEASON. i think you'll all agree he was brilliant last year, but below par this year since his injury return ( until the last few games) hence, him not appearing in the top 100. actim is the truest reflection on a players performance. bit like the premier league itself. its a reflection on a teams performance this season. winning the league is not about playing excellent in the first half of the season and then dissapearing for the second (man city). or playing well in the first half of a game, and playing badly in the second half of a game (fulham would be mid-table if games ended at half time) the league is about overall consistency. decisions for and against, fair and unfair do even themselves out in the season. As for lies, damn lies and statistics, (cant remember who said that)...the premier league table is one big statiscal data gathered up and put in a league table! plus the premier league bases its ranking on 2 variables. firstly wins. then g/d. actim has 13 varibles it accounts for. hey im not for one second suggesting scrapping the premier league though! lol.