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Discussion Starter #1
I just want to clarify a point I was trying to make in the matchday thread regarding Rio and his communication. And before I say this, he was much better/calmer in the second half.

There are times when screaming at a particular player is warranted and necessary. Laziness and dumb mental mistakes are excellent reasons, and Keano was a master at this. Sometimes just a look from him was enough.

BUT, if a player is getting beat regularly by his man (like Evra was by Lennon in the 1st half), screaming at him does absolutely no good whatsoever - in fact it just makes the situation worse. Evra knows better than anyone that Lennon is getting the better of him. A more constructive response is a word of encouragement or advice, better yet, giving/getting him some help.

I have said this before - a captain that screams constantly at teammates (Keano never did this BTW), eventually loses them, they simply will start to tune him out. I say this from my experience, others may have a different perspective.
 

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BUT, if a player is getting beat regularly by his man (like Evra was by Lennon in the 1st half), screaming at him does absolutely no good whatsoever - in fact it just makes the situation worse. .
This is just wrong Moondog!
Maybe if he was bawling out a kid like rafael or Eckersley you may have a case, but it was Evra.
Rio is captain and rightfully gave him a bollocking. I cant see what the problem is.
When I play football I shout/bollock my team mates if its warranted but as soon as the final whistle goes its all forgotten about.
 

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oh and Rio has captained many matches, some very important ones too in these last 2 years and .. his shouts didn`t turn out to be so badly innit ? ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
This is just wrong Moondog!
Maybe if he was bawling out a kid like rafael or Eckersley you may have a case, but it was Evra.
Rio is captain and rightfully gave him a bollocking. I cant see what the problem is.
When I play football I shout/bollock my team mates if its warranted but as soon as the final whistle goes its all forgotten about.
OK, but after all the yelling, did Evra do any better in terms of stopping Lennon? Not from where I was watching.

Anyway, we can agree to disagree. :D
 

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OK, but after all the yelling, did Evra do any better in terms of stopping Lennon? Not from where I was watching.

Anyway, we can agree to disagree. :D
Well yeah. Lennon roasted him all first half, but after that he was kept under wraps mainly.
If you arent playing well, your captain has the right to bollock you.
 

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I just want to clarify a point I was trying to make in the matchday thread regarding Rio and his communication. And before I say this, he was much better/calmer in the second half.

There are times when screaming at a particular player is warranted and necessary. Laziness and dumb mental mistakes are excellent reasons, and Keano was a master at this. Sometimes just a look from him was enough.

BUT, if a player is getting beat regularly by his man (like Evra was by Lennon in the 1st half), screaming at him does absolutely no good whatsoever - in fact it just makes the situation worse. Evra knows better than anyone that Lennon is getting the better of him. A more constructive response is a word of encouragement or advice, better yet, giving/getting him some help.

I have said this before - a captain that screams constantly at teammates (Keano never did this BTW), eventually loses them, they simply will start to tune him out. I say this from my experience, others may have a different perspective.
agreed. screaming at someone constantly might f*ck him up so to speak. and if he isnt very strong mentaly he will just play worse cuz he's like " jeez i must really suck if he is screaming like that...am i really that bad ? oh im letting down my team mates".
when im playing bad and someone tells me something about, i just play worse. doesent matter what level ur playing at.
 

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This is just wrong Moondog!
Maybe if he was bawling out a kid like rafael or Eckersley you may have a case, but it was Evra.
Rio is captain and rightfully gave him a bollocking. I cant see what the problem is.
When I play football I shout/bollock my team mates if its warranted but as soon as the final whistle goes its all forgotten about.
My opinion aswell.

Evra's an experienced pro who was getting ripped to shreds. He deserved a bollocking, aslong as its stays on the pitch...
 

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Rios a leg,all the players neded a spankin today! Evra wasnt the only one getting done by lennon,luckily he cant cross.Rio did what he had to.
 

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Robbie Earle gave an interview here in the States and essentially he spoke about how Keane was the best captain and footballer he'd ever played against. He talked about how he used to scream at his players, but he used to scream encouragement, and not always negative things. For instance, Scholes gave a ball away, and Keano yelled "Scholesy you gotta make that pass, cause you're the only one who can."

That right there is what makes a good captain to me.
 

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Some people were complaining how Ryan Giggs should be more vocal as captain...he is short of shouting and ordering around and yet we have another set of fans who thinks Rio is too vocal regardless of the circumstances. So which is which now?

For me personally, i dont care how they go about doing things as a captain just as long as the message got delivered. Rio has always been loud with or without the captain armband. Just look at the way he celebrated a goal.He look more like wanting to kill the scorer than celebrating. That is just what he is what more as a captain and the head of our defence too, he has every right to have a go at Evra.Thats how passionate he is in the game. As to what effect it will bring to Evra, i think it shouldnt be a question, being in the best team, evra would probably know and see it coming. Such pressure is nothing compared to the fact he is playing for united. We cant possibly blame rio for evra not being on form and not stepping up to it. Rio did what he need to do just like Edwin or Evans shouted at rio when he did a mistake.

When the match is as tense as yesterday, i certainly dont expect rio to walk over to evra, put his hand around his shoulder and say, "look mate..you did good but just to let you know lennon is doing better, you can do better than that surely come on pat..do it..." In the dressing room or after the game maybe but on the pitch while the match is on, i doubt so.
 

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After reading the first post in the thread, id probably disagree. We don't know what Rio said, and shouting at certain players DOES work. End of. I've been captain in the past and played with some bloody good captains, they know what each player needs to lift.
 

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This is just wrong Moondog!
Maybe if he was bawling out a kid like rafael or Eckersley you may have a case, but it was Evra.
Rio is captain and rightfully gave him a bollocking. I cant see what the problem is.
When I play football I shout/bollock my team mates if its warranted but as soon as the final whistle goes its all forgotten about.

and who gave rio a bollocking when he scored that funny own goal against pompey ?

i dunno about the screaming part -you have to be insider to know the player's psychology...some players need a wake up scream some need listening and a calm advice imo

that's why not everyone can be a captain - he must be a very social man who understands psychology
 
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and who gave rio a bollocking when he scored that funny own goal against pompey ?

i dunno about the screaming part -you have to be insider to know the player's psychology...some players need a wake up scream some need listening and a calm advice imo

that's why not everyone can be a captain - he must be a very social man who understands psychology
The own goal was Edwin's fault. Rio played a simple backpass but for some reason Edwin had decided to come running off his line.

Oh and just a reminder, Rio has been captain for much of the last two years, in which time we've won two league titles and the Champions League, plus the Carling Cup yesterday obviously.

He's a great captain and should be first choice now. Neville will never be fit long enough to be a proper captain again and Giggs only plays once a week. I think Rio should have the armband permanently.
 

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The own goal was Edwin's fault. Rio played a simple backpass but for some reason Edwin had decided to come running off his line.

Oh and just a reminder, Rio has been captain for much of the last two years, in which time we've won two league titles and the Champions League, plus the Carling Cup yesterday obviously.

He's a great captain and should be first choice now. Neville will never be fit long enough to be a proper captain again and Giggs only plays once a week. I think Rio should have the armband permanently.
it was a lack of understanding but nevertheless - rio's known for being a slightly error prone - but i can't see anyone else (apart from rooney and vidic ) to be worthy of the armband...

i know your stand on rio and i rate him higly i really do , but it's no crime to think that vida's better - and in my opinion, he is ...

and a serb must really earn croatian's praise;)
 
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it was a lack of understanding but nevertheless - rio's known for being a slightly error prone - but i can't see anyone else (apart from rooney and vidic ) to be worthy of the armband...

i know your stand on rio and i rate him higly i really do , but it's no crime to think that vida's better - and in my opinion, he is ...

and a serb must really earn croatian's praise;)
I stopped reading there. He was error prone 2 or 3 years ago, but in the last 2 seasons he's been the best in the world, no errors.

I really don't see how people still think he's prone to errors if they actually watch him play. It baffles me.
 

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I stopped reading there. He was error prone 2 or 3 years ago, but in the last 2 seasons he's been the best in the world, no errors.

I really don't see how people still think he's prone to errors if they actually watch him play. It baffles me.
just like vida...


but unlike rio - i can't remember a single mistake... plus scores more goals and if they're equal on defensive contribution , that lifts vida a step above imo...

but i have more trust when vida's in the back four - but that's just me
 

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Discussion Starter #19
After reading the first post in the thread, id probably disagree. We don't know what Rio said, and shouting at certain players DOES work. End of. I've been captain in the past and played with some bloody good captains, they know what each player needs to lift.
If you read the first post, you'll note that I said that screaming at players is warranted and necessary at times. But you have to pick your spots - you can't just do it continuously. And in a futher post, I asked whether the screaming at Evra yesterday, in particular, did any good. Answer: no.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Some people were complaining how Ryan Giggs should be more vocal as captain...he is short of shouting and ordering around and yet we have another set of fans who thinks Rio is too vocal regardless of the circumstances. So which is which now?
For me personally, i dont care how they go about doing things as a captain just as long as the message got delivered. Rio has always been loud with or without the captain armband. Just look at the way he celebrated a goal.He look more like wanting to kill the scorer than celebrating. That is just what he is what more as a captain and the head of our defence too, he has every right to have a go at Evra.Thats how passionate he is in the game. As to what effect it will bring to Evra, i think it shouldnt be a question, being in the best team, evra would probably know and see it coming. Such pressure is nothing compared to the fact he is playing for united. We cant possibly blame rio for evra not being on form and not stepping up to it. Rio did what he need to do just like Edwin or Evans shouted at rio when he did a mistake.

When the match is as tense as yesterday, i certainly dont expect rio to walk over to evra, put his hand around his shoulder and say, "look mate..you did good but just to let you know lennon is doing better, you can do better than that surely come on pat..do it..." In the dressing room or after the game maybe but on the pitch while the match is on, i doubt so.
Bold 1 - Tarring me with a brush somewhat? You didn't hear that from me. I have always been on the other side of that argument. IMO I'd much rather have Giggsy's style as captain than Rio's.

Bold 2 - Now that's stretching what I said a little, isn't it? And there are times during a game when you do have that opportunity. But, as captain, I would have preferred Rio to actually do something, like getting someone (nani for example) to give Evra more help when he was struggling to cope with lennon.

Just my opinion tho...
 
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