Manchester United Talk banner

1 - 20 of 31 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Ive never been a big fan of Carrick. When discussing Carrick, fellow fans just point to his ability to pass the ball. Thats just a small segment in playing football.

The Actim Index is the official player ratings system of the Barclays Premiership.
According to actim Carrick is the 70th best performer in the premier league (07/08), the "20th" best midfielder, and united's "9th" best performer this season.

The Actim Index ranks players on a weekly basis according to their performances on the pitch, both by position and in an overall chart, throughout the season. The Actim Index rankings are based on a player's aggregate score for all matches played.

Calculated using a mathematical formula developed by PA Sport alongside statisticians from Salford University, each player’s contribution to matches is examined including GOALS, SHOTS, ASSISTS, PASSES, DRIBBLES, TACKLES, CROSSES, SAVES, CLEARANCES, BLOCKS, INTERCEPTIONS, TIME ON THE PITCH, AND NUMBER OF POINTS GAINED BY THEIR TEAM


Now I would say this is by far the most accurate way of measuring a players performance and putting it on a relative scale. I can already see the pro-carricks screaming " he's the best passer united have", "he's vision is second to none". However these stats account for 13 different variables, so gives credit to all forms of contribution. I dont think hes a United player, maybe a mid-table type of player. A certain Tottenham come to mind!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,814 Posts
He deserves no better in my opinion! He wouldn't get into the teams of any of our rivals I've no time for him.. I used to say he's a good passer but he really gets found out at the top level, games against Roma and Barca his passing (his main attribute) was very poor!
 

·
Smeghead Moderator
Joined
·
13,664 Posts
But surely if he's our 9th best performer this season he deserves to be in our first XI? :confused:

No one can claim that Carrick is World class. He even struggles to get in the England squad but in recent games he's been one of our best performers.

The Actim Index is based on your performance over the season isn't it? I think all United fans will admit Carrick made a slow start to the season but has improved as it has gone on.

These stats are always open to debate. According to them , Reina is the best goalkeeper in the Premiership, Clichy is the best defender in the Premiership and Adebayor is the best striker in the Premiership (no prizes for guessing who the best midfield player is!).

I personally think there have been a few goalkeepers better than Reina this season such as Friedel, James and Howard. Rio and Vidic would both be higher than Clichy for me and I'm sure most people would agree that Torres has been the best striker in the Premiership this season.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
No, actim doesn't take into account how big a players profile is, or how glam his WAG is. Just an accurate measure of a players performance. Now the best performer last season may have been a different player, but that won't influence Actim this year. Because this is accurate and up to date. These are the top 6 this season, i'd say I agree with all of them. I hear what your saying about reinna. Your absolutely right, it's open to debate, but as a general rule, Actim is always right. (At worst give or take one or two poistions).
1.Cristiano Ronaldo Man Utd 755
2 Emmanuel Adebayor Arsenal 698
3 Fernando Torres Liverpool 618
4 Ashley Young Aston Villa 615
5 Roque Santa Cruz Blackburn 602
6 Francesc Fabregas Arsenal 573
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,236 Posts
Carrick gets found out against top teams, like Barca etc. Also, he performs his disappearing act far too regularly against weaker teams in the league, e.g. West Ham in January.

I would love to see De Rossi or Essien in our midfield 10 times more than Carrick.

His goal against WHU looked like slow motion.

All he can do is pass and even against the top teams he continually gives the bal away.
 

·
GET YOUR HEAD OUT THE PUSSY CLOUDS & IN THE GAME
Joined
·
2,659 Posts
Its a shame you all dislike a man united player....especially carrick...fergie has played him in what? 13 consectutive games now...i dont think fergie would play him so much if he wasnt up to it? his performances are top draw...but not world class i agree...long live carrick on the back of my shirt!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
dynamism-any person or thing having a spectacular effect. I think thats a good description of ronnie, maybe scholesy, or even rooney. not carrick.sorry.
 

·
Smeghead Moderator
Joined
·
13,664 Posts
redkhoon said:
Actim is always right.
Ever heard the phrase lies, damn lies and statistics? :p

The Actim Index is a useful tool in debating who is better than who but shouldn't be the only measure used.

Besides your ranking is out of date. As of Tues 6th May the top 10 is...

1 Ronaldo
2 Adebayor
3 Santa Cruz
4 Torres
5 Young
6 Tevez
7 Fabregas
8 Barry
9 Bentley
10 Clichy

Come on - Santa Cruz ahead of Torres? Barry and Bentley in the top 10 players in the Premiership?

I'd say it was very much open to debate.
 

·
GET YOUR HEAD OUT THE PUSSY CLOUDS & IN THE GAME
Joined
·
2,659 Posts
This is what you call an opinionated view....i bet there are other sets of stats that say different
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,457 Posts
Actim is extremely biased in my opinion. Basically the Actim index is heavily, heavily

biased towards players who score heaps of goals. A goal is worth 4 points for a striker,

5 points for a midfielder & 6 points for a defender/goalkeeper. An assist is 3 points.

However Actim doesn't reward outstanding defensive play, like last ditch tackles or

blocks. It doesn't reward a Carrick or Flamini for covering miles of ground in an

energetic display of defensive coverage. All defensive midfielders and defenders get a

raw deal compared to strikers and attacking midfielders. A goalkeeper has to make

three saves to get a single lousy point!
 

·
Smeghead Moderator
Joined
·
13,664 Posts
I've just realised that the ranking redkhoon used is from 29th April.

Between 29th April and 6th May, Santa Cruz went from being the 5th best player in the Premiership to the 3rd best player in the Premiership. During that time Blackburn played 1 game and Santa Cruz scored 2...against Derby.

Sorry but that just makes a mockery of those stats for me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
I think there a few flaws in it. Nevertheless its still the most accurate way of measuring a players performance. Its an overall ranking. Now according actim santa cruz ( in addition to scoring heaps of goals) he contributes alot in other areas. so does that not make him a better all round team player than torres? yes torres has more goals, but that does not make him the better player. Its not bisaed. Do you know how many goals rooney has scored in the league this year? and guess what number he is in actim? 11.in overall rankings.Why? because it has recognised, his hard work, as a tackler, a ball winner, a passer, assists etc. My point was Carrick is not united quality.
 

·
Smeghead Moderator
Joined
·
13,664 Posts
redkhoon said:
I think there a few flaws in it. Nevertheless its still the most accurate way of measuring a players performance. Its an overall ranking. Now according actim santa cruz ( in addition to scoring heaps of goals) he contributes alot in other areas. so does that not make him a better all round team player than torres? yes torres has more goals, but that does not make him the better player. Its not bisaed. Do you know how many goals rooney has scored in the league this year? and guess what number he is in actim? 11.in overall rankings.Why? because it has recognised, his hard work, as a tackler, a ball winner, a passer, assists etc. My point was Carrick is not united quality.
Then the debate to be had is what is better - a striker that works hard for the team like Kuyt or a poacher that contributes little other than goals like Van Nistelrooy. But that's a debate for a whole other thread ;)

If you say Carrick is not United quality but the Actim Index says he is our 9th best player this season then does that mean the vast majority of our squad is not good enough? :confused:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
well reddwraf id be really worried if he wasnt even in the top 11 performers at united, given that we're only allowed 11 so start with! imagine he was 12th best in a team of 11?
 

·
Smeghead Moderator
Joined
·
13,664 Posts
redkhoon said:
well reddwraf id be really worried if he wasnt even in the top 11 performers at united, given that we're only allowed 11 so start with! imagine he was 12th best in a team of 11?
Lol. Yeah true!

But on 29th April there were only 10 United players in the top 100...

1 Ronaldo
8 Tevez
12 Rooney
16 Rio
20 Brown
34 Evra
49 Vidic
50 VDS
70 Carrick
84 Giggs

What about Scholes, Anderson, Park and Hargreaves? Do you rate them?

Don't get me wrong. You have every right to your opinion that Carrick isn't United quality. I'm just arguing that you shouldn't base it on the Actim Index! :D
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
15,336 Posts
Reddwarf's arguments I 100% agree with.

Also, if Carrick was at a team like Tottenham say, he would be a lot higher than he is. But playing for a club like United, you may say its easier to play well, but playing next to players like Rooney, Tevez, Ronaldo, Scholes etc they are obviously going to be our most recognised players because they are the most attacking, and the best players in the team.

But Carrick has been fantastic this season imo. I'm glad he plays for us, and the only reason he doesn't get in the England squad is because hes not "high-profile enough" such as Lampard, Gerrard etc

And also, he plays well in the big games for the person who said he gets caught out at the top level.

And also, if he is our 9th best performer, then surely he deserves to be in the starting 11! :rolleyes:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
For me personally carrick should be no more than a squad player. I dont hate him but i dont think he is worth what we paid for him. I get frustrated watching him, its like watching slow motion, but thats just his style. He has been okay this season, but for me hargo and anderson offer more than carrick.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
of course i rate them. scholsey is one of my fave utd players. and a legend. but actim is not measuring whether he is united legend. or if he's my fave player. but rather his performances THIS SEASON. i think you'll all agree he was brilliant last year, but below par this year since his injury return ( until the last few games) hence, him not appearing in the top 100. actim is the truest reflection on a players performance. bit like the premier league itself. its a reflection on a teams performance this season. winning the league is not about playing excellent in the first half of the season and then dissapearing for the second (man city). or playing well in the first half of a game, and playing badly in the second half of a game (fulham would be mid-table if games ended at half time) the league is about overall consistency. decisions for and against, fair and unfair do even themselves out in the season. As for lies, damn lies and statistics, (cant remember who said that)...the premier league table is one big statiscal data gathered up and put in a league table! plus the premier league bases its ranking on 2 variables. firstly wins. then g/d. actim has 13 varibles it accounts for. hey im not for one second suggesting scrapping the premier league though! lol.
 
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
Top