Manchester United Talk banner

1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,608 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
The number of England-qualified players starting in the Premier League dropped to an all-time low last season, research by BBC Sport has found.

Only 170 of the 498 players who started matches in the top flight in 2007-08 were English - just 34.1% of the total.

It marks a big slide from 2006-07, when 191 (38%) of the starters were English. "The number is important because that's what I can choose from," said England manager Fabio Capello when asked about BBC Sport's findings on Tuesday.

"But more important is quality - the level of the player. At the moment the total is 34% but the (quality) level is high.
"The work being done in the academies is very important. We probably have to change the system of training for young players.

"At Under-21, and younger national teams, we have a lot of good players.

"For the future, I hope next season is not 34% but 40%. It will be better for me and England football."

At first glance, Capello's diplomatic answer would seem to make complete sense. After all, only last week two English clubs played in the Champions League final and 10 of the 22 starters were English.

But the fact remains that his side is preparing for two end-of-season friendlies this week - against the USA on Wednesday and Trinidad and Tobago on Sunday - and not this summer's Euro 2008.

Sepp Blatter, the president of world football's governing body Fifa, is convinced he knows the answer to England's problems: restricting the number of foreign starters each club is allowed to five.

Despite widespread concern his plan is incompatible with European Union employment law (and robust opposition from the Premier League on principle),

Blatter is determined to press on with his "six plus five" scheme. If successful, this move would represent a huge challenge for English clubs. Last season, fewer than one in five starting line-ups would have met Blatter's quota.

On average, there were only four players available for England duty in each Premier League starting line-up last season.

Arsenal had the lowest number of English starters, averaging 0.34 per match, while West Ham had the highest number, with 6.61.

The Hammers and Aston Villa (6.42) were the only two clubs in the Premier League to average more than six English starters last term, while the big four of Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, averaged just 2.64 per game.

These figures compare unfavourably with the situation in Scotland, where there were 6.27 Scotland-qualified players per starting line-up in the Scottish Premier League.

While only 18% of English line-ups met the quota, 56.8% of Scotland's starting XIs would have satisfied Blatter. In fact, six of the 12 SPL teams - Aberdeen, Inverness Caledonian Thistle, Kilmarnock, St Mirren, Motherwell and Rangers - met the "six plus five" rule in every match.

Scotland, of course, also failed to qualify for Euro 2008 but the English numbers are also considerably worse than Europe's other major leagues.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/7417746.stm

BBC Sports News

This fails to take into account that we have Scots, Welsh and Irish playing in the Premiership - all considered "home" players. Do these count as "foreign" players in Sepp Blatters "5 a game" ???
 
S

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
The number of players who started the first Premier League
matches of the 1992/93 season:

England = 175
Northern Ireland = 4
Republic of Ireland = 13
Scotland = 19
Wales = 18
Overseas = 13

The number of players who started the first Premier League
matches of the 2007/8 season:

England = 81
Northern Ireland = 3
Republic of Ireland = 14
Scotland = 4
Wales = 7
Overseas = 111
.

You'll soon be reading about it
You'll soon be hearing about it

You might even want to have access to it

The Meltdown Report by the PFA
http://edition.pagesuite-professional.co.uk/Launch.aspx?referral=other&refresh=W1a408JzyL19&EID=095118a5-4201-40ae-a055-1a7e3cf16837

When the page loads, there is a menu bar across the bottom
First Previous Next Last - between Previous and Next is an "up" pointing arrow - click there and click "Create PDF"
all 20 thumbnails will load
click "Select all"
click "Create PDF"

It is from the Professional Footballers' Association, and it is their "report on the nationality of Premier League players and the future of English football".

Lots of stats, charts, graphs, opinions and commentaries about the domestic game and the impact that "foreigners" have had on the domestic game.


an interesting read.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
503 Posts
Good for the Premiership, bad for England?

To me i dont have a problem with it, As for england as a team they dont have a clue & dont think it has anything to do with having so many foreign player's in the premiership, This is basically used as an excuse for england's poor performances as a national team, Without mentioning any names none seem to be comitted like they are for club, That's just my opinion though :)
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
23,699 Posts
Top clubs are 'helping England's opponents,' says Blatter

Do you agree with Blatter.... for once?



the independent
By Gordon Tynan, Friday, 6 June 2008

England's failure to reach Euro 2008 was partly due to Premier League clubs helping overseas players reach the peak of their game and benefiting their own countries, the Fifa president, Sepp Blatter, said yesterday.

Blatter, speaking in Zurich, said: "It is a fact that in the strongest English teams the best players are not always English. So where are the best English players coming from? They are coming from the less strong teams, which is weakening the English national team. What is happening in England is that the best teams are preparing the national team players for England's opponents."


Fifa yesterday announced it will not wipe England's friendly against Trinidad & Tobago from the record books despite a mistake over substitutions. The game's world governing body did not give special dispensation for seven rather than the maximum of six substitutions, but said that it had been a mistake by the referee Enrico Wijngaarde.

Several England players made their first appearances in the 3-0 win which helped England move back inside the world's top 10 teams. The decision will be a relief for the FA.
 
Z

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
versa said:
Do you agree with Blatter.... for once?



the independent
By Gordon Tynan, Friday, 6 June 2008

England's failure to reach Euro 2008 was partly due to Premier League clubs helping overseas players reach the peak of their game and benefiting their own countries, the Fifa president, Sepp Blatter, said yesterday.

Blatter, speaking in Zurich, said: "It is a fact that in the strongest English teams the best players are not always English. So where are the best English players coming from? They are coming from the less strong teams, which is weakening the English national team. What is happening in England is that the best teams are preparing the national team players for England's opponents."


Fifa yesterday announced it will not wipe England's friendly against Trinidad & Tobago from the record books despite a mistake over substitutions. The game's world governing body did not give special dispensation for seven rather than the maximum of six substitutions, but said that it had been a mistake by the referee Enrico Wijngaarde.

Several England players made their first appearances in the 3-0 win which helped England move back inside the world's top 10 teams. The decision will be a relief for the FA.
Ashley Cole
John Terry
Rio Ferdinand
Gary Neville
Frank Lampard
Steven Gerrard
Joe Cole
Wayne Rooney

The above is a list of players that, when fully fit,
always seem to start for England. Eight out of
eleven of these are from the 'top four', not from
the 'less strong teams'. Sepp Blatter, as usual, is
talking rubbish. The England national team is
chocked full of world class players, they just lack
the team cohesion of other national sides such as
Argentina, Brazil, Italy etc.

The fact that all of them play in the same league
could possibly be the problem(or one of them).
They are all rivals week in and week out, whereas
other nations have players playing in various countries
across the world and are not rivals.

The lack of success for the England team MAY be down,
in part, to the fact that they all play for the stronger
teams in the Premier League rather than the weaker
teams as Blatter wrongly points out.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
23,699 Posts
Good arguments against with clear, concise thoughts, zuco. ;)

But the IP address advertised... Is it yours or mine? :eek: :D :eek:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
934 Posts
-zuco- said:
Ashley Cole
John Terry
Rio Ferdinand
Gary Neville
Frank Lampard
Steven Gerrard
Joe Cole
Wayne Rooney

The above is a list of players that, when fully fit,
always seem to start for England. Eight out of
eleven of these are from the 'top four', not from
the 'less strong teams'. Sepp Blatter, as usual, is
talking rubbish. The England national team is
chocked full of world class players, they just lack
the team cohesion of other national sides such as
Argentina, Brazil, Italy etc.

The fact that all of them play in the same league
could possibly be the problem(or one of them).
They are all rivals week in and week out, whereas
other nations have players playing in various countries
across the world and are not rivals.

The lack of success for the England team MAY be down,
in part, to the fact that they all play for the stronger
teams in the Premier League rather than the weaker
teams as Blatter wrongly points out.
Great arguement, Zuco. I totally agree.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
23,699 Posts
-zuco- said:
Yours.

I'm watching ;)
:eek: No wonder I always feel like somebody is watching me.. :rolleyes:

So any suggestion to make the necessary changes to get a more positive outcome for the national team, given what you have identified that does not look like it will change in the conceivable future?
 
Z

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
In my opinion it'll never change unless English
players start playing abroad.

It will have double benefits. The players won't
ALL be rivals in the same league. And some of
them will gain experience and knowledge of so
called 'continental football' and become more cultured.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
23,699 Posts
-zuco- said:
In my opinion it'll never change unless English
players start playing abroad.

It will have double benefits. The players won't
ALL be rivals in the same league. And some of
them will gain experience and knowledge of so
called 'continental football' and become more cultured.
So does that mean that English national team has no hope for major honours until English players start going abroad? How frightening and depressing that would be...

But please stop advertising members' IP address. How frightening and depressing that would be too...

[Now you know I have come back home from office!!? :eek: Invasion of privacy!!:eek: May need to consult legal advice.... ]
 
Z

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
versa said:
So does that mean that English national team has no hope for major honours until English players start going abroad? How frightening and depressing that would be...

But please stop advertising members' IP address. How frightening and depressing that would be too...

[Now you know I have come back home from office!!? Invasion of privacy!! May need to consult legal advice.... ]
I'm just saying that's one of the factors, not the only factor :)

Watching England has always been depressing, nothing new there ;)

With regards to advertising ip addresses, only you can see your own
ip address, I can see mine, whoever looks at the sig sees their own
and nobody else's :p
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
23,699 Posts
-zuco- said:
I'm just saying that's one of the factors, not the only factor :)

Watching England has always been depressing, nothing new there ;)

With regards to advertising ip addresses, only you can see your own
ip address, I can see mine, whoever looks at the sig sees their own
and nobody else's :p
Ok, ok. An IT idiot will save some consultation fees. :D
 

·
Smeghead Moderator
Joined
·
13,665 Posts
I think the quality of the coach has a major bearing on the success of our national team. We've never had a team full of World class talent but some managers can get the best out of players.

Steve McClaren was tactically inept at club level, never mind International level. Graham Taylor had the tactical nous of a turnip.

On the otherhand, our team in 1990 had a few great players but it wasn't a great team or squad that Bobby Robson took to the semi-finals of the World Cup. Similarly, with Terry Venables in 96 - a good team but not many World class players.

We have good players in this country. The media build them up far too much but you no one can convince me that the likes of Ferdinand, Terry, A & J Cole, Gerrard, Lampard, Rooney and Owen are not top class International players.

We just need a coach who knows how to use them - Sven Goran Eriksson was underated when he was in charge. I'm cautiously optimistic about our future now Capello is in charge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,608 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
England were brilliant to watch, win or lose, until the mid 80s, then it started to go downhill. It does not matter if they have the best manager in the world, a mediocre team will win nothing..............................

Blatter is right; we need more home grown at home!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,956 Posts
Just watch England play ...

Then you will see why they never win !!

The fans are fickle ...

The players don't have a "never say die" attitude and lack passion !

The players are all too used to being treated like 'prima donnas' ...

The press and media are unforgiving !!

For example:

The fans ...

Capellos first match was eagerly awaited - he was the great 'saviour' !

It took 28 minutes for the fans to start booing, lol.

The players are a mixed bunch ...

I saw Gerrard play for England on one wednesday game (I for get which)
and to be frank, he was dire, dismal, terrible ... then on the Saturday
he put in one of the best performance for Liverpool I have ever seen !!

Right or wrong ... many managers hate to release players for International
duty. Giggsy would have double the caps he has if Fergie had realeased
him and not fabricated excuses for him not to play !

Many, many, many United fans say United > England !!!

The England manager never gets support from managers of the top clubs !!

The press are disgraceful too ... all they want is bad news, gossip and
exclusives on misdemeanors by the players ... and a couple of lines
at the top of the article to get it on the sports pages !!

The money is, once again, an issue for me too. England players were
paid £200,000 EACH ... FOR FAILING TO QUALIFY FOR EURO 2008 !!!

Why ...

Since when, in the real world, was failure rewarded ?

The England players biggest allegiance is with their clubs obviously ...
but there should be some desire and ambition to do well with their
national team ... but a very few of them ever seem to have given their
all for England. Very few show emotion and exhaustion after a game !!

I always mention my country Romania in these issues - but they are
all I know in detail. But they are also a great example. If you look at
our first team, and take away Adrian Mutu ... they are all unknown ...
some play for Cluj and Timosoara ... you have never heard of these
towns or mention of the teams from these places. Cluj and Timosoara
are maybe good enough for League one on a good day ... but nowhere
near good enough for the Championship !!!

And yet we are 12th in the world, lol.... how ?

Our players got nothing for playing for Romania until recently, they now
get £7000 I think. They play because they are proud of Romania, it is
an honour and a privilege to play for them. The press look for ways we
can WIN and not ways to lose. The manager is worshipped wherever
he goes ... he is a hero, he is treated like royalty !! If he eats in a
restaurant he is given the best service, best food, best drink - and the
bill is ripped up and thrown away !!

Not playing abroad is no excuse really ... Steaua Bucuresti won the
Champions League with 11 Romanian players who were all unpaid !!
8 of this 11 were internationals too !!! They made the final the following
year as well.

Only one man could lift England, stop the press and their character
assassination of the players, lift the fans with pride, passion and emotion ....
and have every English person chanting his name !!!

...... Jose Mourinho !!

They have the players, no question about that ... but it must start with
the fans !! They should show more respect to these guys - and the
players should do the same and have more passion and commitment
to the national cause.

Romanians love their national team no matter what !!

I'm not stupid and I know Romania could get beaten 4-0 in all three
Euro 2008 games - on paper they should do as well.

But they wont ... no way !!

France, Holland and Italy better watch out !! Our guys will run until they
cant stand up, they will fight for every ball and show no fear !! ......
and if they lose 4-0 so be it ... like my sig says ...

Romania - we love you and are proud of you !!

The England fans, players, manager and the press might like to follow
this recipe !! And just watch England win then !!! Because yes ... they would !!!

Beat that for a long post Versa, lol ... ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,608 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
There is no competition for England places; there is nobody to make them think, "I'd best play my best, or dropped" - the England team picks itself. Its been so bad that if you recall, Phil Neville played more games for England than he did for United!!
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
23,699 Posts
carlyluvsunited said:
Beat that for a long post Versa, lol ... ;)
1. What a great post! [:eek: :D ]

2. I can't beat that. When you have a strong conviction and confidence about certain issues, nobody can. ;)
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top