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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #1
this is basically a thread where we can continue from Rooney thread without ruining it

When mourinho first came to chelsea we were in transition while Chelsea they were an all-conquering force. When Fergie got the team matched up and we got rid of the dross we were better team than chelsea when we won the title and we would have won again had mourinho stayed on that season when he was let go.
oh yeah, let us assume that we would have won it had mourinho stayed...and you were criticizing me for saying that mourinho would win the CL with real and yet you're the one who can forsee the future and I'm not ;)

Stats : Fergie and Mourinho went head to head 15 times, including 2 legs against porto in 2004.

Fergie won ONLY TWICE.

How does that makes Fergie better than Mourinho???
this

Like corooney said we beat them at old trafford when fletcher scored. He was also extremely lucky not to get knocked out by us when we he managed porto where we had a legitimate goal disallowed when scholes was ruled unfairly offside.
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hmm, you're talking about luck in winning the CL ? we had a tramendeus dose of luck BOTH TIMES when Fergie won it . Beginning from the quarterfinals with Inter back in 99, when Schemichel brought Zamorano down for a CLEAR PENALTY while they were leading, to that remarkable night against Juve away, that happens once in a generation, and finally, we weren't excactly the better team in the final. Bayern struck the woodwork and had plenty more chances to score, but who remembers that?

And the last time we won, we won it due to a Terry slip, so we're the last ones who should be talking about luck

Ranieri already laid down the foundations for chelsea the season prior to that and finished second. Anyhow sadly we won't be able to continue this discussion as it's off topic, I'll probably create a thread on it later some time so we can discuss it more in depth.
Ranieri did lay some foundations, but Mourinho brought Carvalho, Drogba, Cole, Cech and some new players that proved to be vital for their play. Mourinho brought the spine of today's Chelsea
 

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Ferguson does expect one of his old foes, Jose Mourinho, to make Real Madrid a much more potent prospect.

"Signing Mourinho has upped the ante for Real. They'll have a better chance now - he's got a better squad," he said. "He's the first Real coach that's bought players with a plan.''

Code:
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11945_6372517,00.html
 

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Was this thread made to flame Fergie in some way? By exposing how he's nt a good tactician? We made Inter look like children a couple champions leagues ago...
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #4
Was this thread made to flame Fergie in some way? By exposing how he's nt a good tactician? We made Inter look like children a couple champions leagues ago...
no it wasn't...it was aimed at sepiroth who said that fergie is a master tactitian who is head to head better than mourinho

if you want you can go back to rooney thread just to check out the history of the conversation
 

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Was this thread made to flame Fergie in some way? By exposing how he's nt a good tactician? We made Inter look like children a couple champions leagues ago...
Fergie is a GOOD tactician surely, but definitely not as good as Mourinho.

Sephiroth here is saying that despite Fergie losing out to Mourinho more than winning, Fergie is still the better Tactician.
 

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Fergie is a GOOD tactician surely, but definitely not as good as Mourinho.

Sephiroth here is saying that despite Fergie losing out to Mourinho more than winning, Fergie is still the better Tactician.
I'm saying he is not a kitten compared to Mourinho in regards to tactics and proved he was more than a match for his chelsea side when we had a decent enough squad that had finished going through transition. And mainly arguing against Pinky's claim that Quieroz was the hidden hand and brains behind all our success which just really insultive towards Fergies true accomplishments. Anyone who is under that delusion needs to look past seasons 2007/08 and see how successful fergie has been without him both at United and Aberdeen.You don't survive as long as fergie by being just a ''goo tactician''. People like you just think he's a screamer and needs someone beside to talk him to calm him down and explain formations which is just stupid. I'll go into corooney's post a bit more when I have a bit of a break.
 

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beautiful, dirty, rich...
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mourinho went to the the premier leagues richest team and won silverware... he then went to serie a's richest team and won silverware... now he is in la liga with, yes you guessed it, the leagues richest team, and no doubt he will win silverware...

its very easy to look like a tactical mastermind when for the last 5,6yrs you have had footballs biggest pots of gold to spend, and the worlds best players at your dissposal...

ps. scholes goal is allowed, or howard doesnt drop a last minute clanger, and its a case of mourinho who?
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #8
mourinho went to the the premier leagues richest team and won silverware... he then went to serie a's richest team and won silverware... now he is in la liga with, yes you guessed it, the leagues richest team, and no doubt he will win silverware...

its very easy to look like a tactical mastermind when for the last 5,6yrs you have had footballs biggest pots of gold to spend, and the worlds best players at your dissposal...

ps. scholes goal is allowed, or howard doesnt drop a last minute clanger, and its a case of mourinho who?
he won UEFA CUP and CL with Porto...

as for the lucky Howard goal...I've already explained how lucky we were to win the 2 CL...you always need luck and the bottom line is, is that we didn't beat his Porto side...Also, were they lucky when they spanked us at OT 3-1 or when they spanked us 3-0 at the Bridge

There has been plenty of managers who were at the big spending clubs but failed to deliver ... Real is a perfect example of that... Or Inter... Besides, the last time I checked we were amoung the richest clubs in the world .. Mourinho is an excelent tactician - There isn't a manager in the world who would beat Chelsea and Barcelona they why he did - completely due to marvelous tactics
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #9
I'm saying he is not a kitten compared to Mourinho in regards to tactics and proved he was more than a match for his chelsea side when we had a decent enough squad that had finished going through transition. And mainly arguing against Pinky's claim that Quieroz was the hidden hand and brains behind all our success which just really insultive towards Fergies true accomplishments. Anyone who is under that delusion needs to look past seasons 2007/08 and see how successful fergie has been without him both at United and Aberdeen.You don't survive as long as fergie by being just a ''goo tactician''. People like you just think he's a screamer and needs someone beside to talk him to calm him down and explain formations which is just stupid. I'll go into corooney's post a bit more when I have a bit of a break.

Mate, Fergie's tactical decisions can't be compared to those of Capello or Mourinho... Ancelotti is ahead of him in my books also, so is Sacchi - but I'm not trying to criticize him - it's just that there are better managers in that aspect, and it is not a shame to be behind them. If anything it only highlights how good man manager he is
 

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Tbf I have always thought Fergie was a poor tactician. If you look back to the Everton game, Fergie made more mistakes than any of the players did.
 

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beautiful, dirty, rich...
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St. Mirren

Scottish First Division (1): 1976–77

Aberdeen

Scottish Premier Division (3): 1979–80, 1983–84, 1984–85
Scottish Cup (4): 1981–82, 1982–83, 1983–84, 1985–86
Scottish League Cup (1): 1985–86
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1982–83
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1983

Manchester United

Premier League (11): 1992–93, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08, 2008–09
FA Cup (5): 1989–90, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1998–99, 2003–04
League Cup (4): 1991–92, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
FA Charity/Community Shield (9): 1990*, 1993, 1994, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2010 (* shared)
UEFA Champions League (2): 1998–99, 2007–08
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1990–91
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1991
Intercontinental Cup (1): 1999
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2008


terrible tactician...



f*ckin idiots!
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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11,077 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
St. Mirren

Scottish First Division (1): 1976–77

Aberdeen

Scottish Premier Division (3): 1979–80, 1983–84, 1984–85
Scottish Cup (4): 1981–82, 1982–83, 1983–84, 1985–86
Scottish League Cup (1): 1985–86
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1982–83
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1983

Manchester United

Premier League (11): 1992–93, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08, 2008–09
FA Cup (5): 1989–90, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1998–99, 2003–04
League Cup (4): 1991–92, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
FA Charity/Community Shield (9): 1990*, 1993, 1994, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2010 (* shared)
UEFA Champions League (2): 1998–99, 2007–08
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1990–91
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1991
Intercontinental Cup (1): 1999
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2008


terrible tactician...



f*ckin idiots!
who ?

no one's saying that he's poor tactitian FFS, it's just he's not as good as those we stated and he certainly isn't amoung the top ones ...

This thread exists only because we stopped going OT at Roo's thread

besides , when talking about tactics, it mean apporaching the opponent by focusing on their strenghts and weaknesses , to studying opponents and fergie most of the times plays his own way without studying an opponent like mourinho or capello would...like I said, his greatest tactical move is to pack the midfield with 5 and to switch flanks.. Mourinho's Chelsea approach last season was a mastermind of a tactitician - the way they played pressing for the ball instead of the player had not been seen in recent years..and you need an enitre team running constantly for the entire 90 minutes... I've listend experts talkign about it, and it seems simple but trust me, it's not ( one of Mourinho's menthors spoke about that)
 

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St. Mirren

Scottish First Division (1): 1976–77

Aberdeen

Scottish Premier Division (3): 1979–80, 1983–84, 1984–85
Scottish Cup (4): 1981–82, 1982–83, 1983–84, 1985–86
Scottish League Cup (1): 1985–86
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1982–83
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1983

Manchester United

Premier League (11): 1992–93, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08, 2008–09
FA Cup (5): 1989–90, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1998–99, 2003–04
League Cup (4): 1991–92, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
FA Charity/Community Shield (9): 1990*, 1993, 1994, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2010 (* shared)
UEFA Champions League (2): 1998–99, 2007–08
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1990–91
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1991
Intercontinental Cup (1): 1999
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2008


terrible tactician...



f*ckin idiots!
Its just these new generation fans that are taken in by the hype. A few years back when Benetiz won the champions league I spoke to a few united fans that argued he was better tactically than fergie. Thanks for saving me the time having to put this thread bed. We got one person saying fergie is a poor tactician because of the everton game. which just sums up what kind of supporters we have on board. I'm 100% sure that if Ferguson was French, Spanish, Italian with a name such as Ferginhotelli almost anything but Scottish or English, he would be largely viewed as the best tactician around
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #15
Its just these new generation fans that are taken in by the hype. A few years back when Benetiz won the champions league I spoke to a few united fans that argued he was better tactically than fergie. Thanks for saving me the time having to put this thread bed. We got one person saying fergie is a poor tactician because of the everton game. which just sums up what kind of supporters we have on board. I'm 100% sure that if Ferguson was French, Spanish, Italian with a name such as Ferginhotelli almost anything but Scottish or English, he would be largely viewed as the best tactician around
no he wouldn't - it has nothing to do with his name - what's your problem ?

btw, are you callying me a new generation fan ? i'm older than you, you know... fergie is not the best tactitian around...not at all

jesus !

one more thing, I don't rate Benitez but when it comes to knockout stages, there are few better than him in those...especially with such a limited team he had, which has nothing to do with tactics
 

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beautiful, dirty, rich...
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this is, without doubt, the dumbest f*ckin thread on any board, on any website, since the very inception of the internet (as we know it today) back in 1992...

'sir alex ferguson is a poor tactician'... and coming from our very own fans!?!?
 

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beautiful, dirty, rich...
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who ?

no one's saying that he's poor tactitian FFS, it's just he's not as good as those we stated and he certainly isn't amoung the top ones ...

This thread exists only because we stopped going OT at Roo's thread

besides , when talking about tactics, it mean apporaching the opponent by focusing on their strenghts and weaknesses , to studying opponents and fergie most of the times plays his own way without studying an opponent like mourinho or capello would...like I said, his greatest tactical move is to pack the midfield with 5 and to switch flanks.. Mourinho's Chelsea approach last season was a mastermind of a tactitician - the way they played pressing for the ball instead of the player had not been seen in recent years..and you need an enitre team running constantly for the entire 90 minutes... I've listend experts talkign about it, and it seems simple but trust me, it's not ( one of Mourinho's menthors spoke about that)
St. Mirren

Scottish First Division (1): 1976–77

Aberdeen

Scottish Premier Division (3): 1979–80, 1983–84, 1984–85
Scottish Cup (4): 1981–82, 1982–83, 1983–84, 1985–86
Scottish League Cup (1): 1985–86
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1982–83
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1983

Manchester United

Premier League (11): 1992–93, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08, 2008–09
FA Cup (5): 1989–90, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1998–99, 2003–04
League Cup (4): 1991–92, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
FA Charity/Community Shield (9): 1990*, 1993, 1994, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2010 (* shared)
UEFA Champions League (2): 1998–99, 2007–08
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1990–91
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1991
Intercontinental Cup (1): 1999
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2008


im sure fergie had to set a team up for a big game to win a few of those...
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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11,077 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
St. Mirren

Scottish First Division (1): 1976–77

Aberdeen

Scottish Premier Division (3): 1979–80, 1983–84, 1984–85
Scottish Cup (4): 1981–82, 1982–83, 1983–84, 1985–86
Scottish League Cup (1): 1985–86
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1982–83
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1983

Manchester United

Premier League (11): 1992–93, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08, 2008–09
FA Cup (5): 1989–90, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1998–99, 2003–04
League Cup (4): 1991–92, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
FA Charity/Community Shield (9): 1990*, 1993, 1994, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2010 (* shared)
UEFA Champions League (2): 1998–99, 2007–08
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup (1): 1990–91
UEFA Super Cup (1): 1991
Intercontinental Cup (1): 1999
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2008


im sure fergie had to set a team up for a big game to win a few of those...
of course...but my point is to show sepiroth that NO , Fergie does not hold advantage over Mourinho, and is not amoung the best tactitians around...

here in Croatia we had a handball manager who won us the olympics, the world cup, the world championship, and won a few bronze medals along with playing a few finals...and everyone knows that his main strenghts were motivation and assembling the team of great young talents along with some quality older players...plus, we had the greatest player of all time playing for us..he's not amoung the best tactitians but we don't care...all you can hear from him in timeout is : We mustn't conceed, we need to stay focused, we must score, we have a minute left etc...I mean wtf, even I can do that, but that's not the point - you can be a very successful manager without being the master tactitian..and it's not a shame to admit it...you need to have a good team around you , a good scouting network and you have to have a special mentality to succeed
 

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Over the course of time, like a season or a few seasons its very hard for anyone to compete with Fergie. On a one off game I think Jose is better, especially now because Fergie seems more interested in rotating mediocre players than a strong, settled team.
 
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