I'm still worried!!...

2184 Views 54 Replies 23 Participants Last post by Drew9, May 5, 2008

desmondo

Discussion Starter · May 3, 2008

It would be easy for those of us who don't agree with all of fergie's tactics to keep quiet right now after the wins against Barca and WH , but as I have said before , it's not about the results.

Right now we have won NOTHING , absolutely nothing at all and these two games were at OT. The honours will be dished out on the basis of what United do away from OT. You may laugh at me , but despite all the singing at OT and Fergies smiles I still think they are quite capable of blundering it all away by not being true to the very football that has brought them this far. Chelsea have a better away record than us and grind and fight like dogs to get results. We seem to want to leave it to the last 10 minutes of games when it gets desperate before we create chance after chance and score. This could easily have happened against Barca and could easily happen against Wigan if we try and play them on the break and sit back.

Last week against Chelsea , Anderson came off after a period when United were really coming into the game . So instead of driving at them and putting crosses into their box it was our box that came under pressure and it was Carrick who handballed when it could have been Essien. United would now be celebrating the Title.

So , will everyone stop their "we win everything's fine , we lose then it's disaster" philosophy and look at what's really happening. It's been a long time since this team really did itself justice away from OT. Why? Because we have become passive impersonaters of negative teams that don't have our talent.

Ok , let's have the flak now!!!...........

See less See more

41 - 55 of 55 Posts

sweet fa

· #41 · May 4, 2008

in all honesty this team is still in the making,when chelsea won the league in 05 every football fan in the premier league thought they would dominate for at least 5 years before anybody got near them well fergie somehow stopped them at 2 titles.
utd have improved as a squad again this season but we have got a couple of glaring weaknesse's ,firstly we need a striker who can spearhead utds attack with a physical prescence and secondly we need a quality right back because that position is a big weakness at the moment.wes brown is a decent squad player to have but he makes far too many mistakes to be a first choice player and i have always said that of him.
fergie will improve the team again in the summer and if he gets it right utd will be dominateing for a couple more years,by the way i can't see utd failing to win the premier league this year not from this position.

See less See more

Titface

· #42 · May 4, 2008

we just need to be cautious and not take anything for granted!

both games are winnable.....but i for once will be pooing my pants if we dont get an early goal in either...

Jay007

· #43 · May 4, 2008

dlan4327 said:
I know what you mean about being true to our brand of football but frankly we did that last season and it got us all the way to the semi's just so we could experience what it's like to get spanked at the San Siro. Europe just doesn't favour attacking football. You may talk about Barcelona back in 2006 but even they had an appreciation of defence in their own way. They knew how to dominate possession which in a way is defence.

Also they had Ronaldinho at the height of his powers. Whoever had Ronaldinho at that time was always going to win. One last thing people might be tempted to say well we have Ronaldo now but, with all due respect, Ronaldo now is nowhere near Ronaldinho then.

This is a very good point, one which I totally agree with.

Jazz 16 said:
I can see a lot of valid points and good posts in this thread but if we win
the double then I wouldnt be too worried about the style of our play or
tactics in the future.(because clearly they would have worked)
The Wigan game is away and we will more than likely HAVE to go out and win
it so Fergie will be playing 2 up top and going for it in style. Im sure of it.

The game against Chelsea is a different matter altogether. Its one we must win
but I can see fergie playing 'negatively' or playing 4-5-1.
Whether thats the right thing to do or not ramins to be seen.
We have to wait for the result to judge that one.

If we do end up winning the double I couldnt care less how it happens as long
as it happens.
As some have said before we have won nothing yet but to be in this position
at this stage of the season is very satisfying.
If we win the next 2 games we are champs of England and Europe.
Happy days.

This is a great point as well. In finals (of course, the last Prem game is a 'final' as we could win the Prem at the end of it) playing attacking, 'gung-ho' football doesn't necessarily get the result, as 'negative football' as some people put it, doesn't wield the desired result either. But whatever we decide to play, as long as we win I couldn't care less at this point

.

desmondo said:
I don't have a major problem with United playing on the break so much if there is more urgency to press the ball and get opponents to make mistakes. Where I really struggle is when I see the opposition looking far too comfortable in possession and gaining confidence by passing it around with ease right to the edge of our box.

What I want United to do is defend aggressively in midefield as a team by pressing the ball more often and putting the other team under pressure

Mate, I misunderstood you. I understand what you mean now. I thought you meant we should go out every game no matter what and throw players forward at will.

But yeah, that point annoys me too, but its the way we seem to always play, no matter who we play. In the squad, the only players who seem to press the ball in midfield or up front are Park, Tevez, Fletcher, Anderson and Hargreaves (although Hargreaves has been playing RB recently.)

I do feel that we need to press more and put the opposition under pressure too. That is why I felt we needed Anderson on instead of O'Shea. Not only did O'Shea mean we sat back, but, not only does Anderson press, adds bite to the midfield and challenge to try to win the ball, but he has the abilty to take the ball forward when we do counter. That is why in the CL final I would play a central 3 in midfield of Scholes, Carrick and Anderson with Tevez and Ronaldo supporting Rooney. (I previously wanted Park to play. If we played the Pool I would say Park, but I feel he will be bullied by Chelsea's physical play)

Quick on the counter, plenty of men forward and pressure on the ball. Thats what I think we need to play to beat Chelsea.

P.S Sorry for the misunderstanding.

See less See more

carlyluvsunited

· #44 · May 5, 2008

"United's trademark style of attacking football !!"

How many times have we ... gone through the league stages quite easily ?

Quite often as it happens ... average teams so we kick their butts ...

Then on to the last 32, 16 and 8 ...

Last 8 is where we always seem to finish up without too many problems ...

Then the problems start !!!

Lst 8 game is dependant on who we draw ... we may/may not win.

And as for the semi finals ...

This kind of 'Cavalier' style of football is rubbish !!

It beats the teams in the Prem League ... As can be seen by Fergie's 10 Titles !

But as soon as we have come face to face with Europe's 'Big Guys' ...

They spank our bottom and send us home !!!

Fergie changes the tactics .... and now we make the final !!!!

Read into that what you will ...

See less See more

dckyfoxes

· #45 · May 5, 2008

At the moment... we should stay positive... We have a game away to Wigan, let's take it to them... They have nothing to play for and we have everything to play for... At the moment we have nothing... In my heart we are the champions...

sparkic

· #46 · May 5, 2008

As long as Fergie choses the strongest team we shall win imo...

desmondo

Discussion Starter · #47 · May 5, 2008

carlyluvsunited said:
"United's trademark style of attacking football !!"

How many times have we ... gone through the league stages quite easily ?

Quite often as it happens ... average teams so we kick their butts ...

Then on to the last 32, 16 and 8 ...

Last 8 is where we always seem to finish up without too many problems ...

Then the problems start !!!

Lst 8 game is dependant on who we draw ... we may/may not win.

And as for the semi finals ...

This kind of 'Cavalier' style of football is rubbish !!

It beats the teams in the Prem League ... As can be seen by Fergie's 10 Titles !

But as soon as we have come face to face with Europe's 'Big Guys' ...

They spank our bottom and send us home !!!

Fergie changes the tactics .... and now we make the final !!!!

Read into that what you will ...

The problem with this analysis is that it is based on the outcome of matches rather than what actually happens on the pitch at the time. Take Dortmund 97 for example. United were incredibly unlucky in both games and should have had a lead from the first leg but in my mind fergie had that down as a "gun-ho cavalier" game. The reality was that if those games were played 100 times again United would win 85% of the time at least.

Against Milan last year we just had an injury ravaged defence and made 2 or 3 bad mistakes in defence that could happen in any game. Look at real madrid (0-0) and monaco (0-0). Both away results were deemed successes but away goals cost us dearly because we were too negative in the 1st leg. Against Porto (2004) I thought we protected what we had too much and they scored in the last minute. There's also the consideration that a lot of the time United have been drawn and gone out against the eventual winners of the competition.

I keep saying this but I think it's a mistake to think that the only choice is between the performance at the Nou camp (negative) and cavalier football . There is a balance in between. Milan last year were positive away from home in the first leg looking to take advantage of our wobbly defence and then they went and won it.

See less See more

desmondo

Discussion Starter · #48 · May 5, 2008

manutd004 said:
This is a very good point, one which I totally agree with.

This is a great point as well. In finals (of course, the last Prem game is a 'final' as we could win the Prem at the end of it) playing attacking, 'gung-ho' football doesn't necessarily get the result, as 'negative football' as some people put it, doesn't wield the desired result either. But whatever we decide to play, as long as we win I couldn't care less at this point .

Mate, I misunderstood you. I understand what you mean now. I thought you meant we should go out every game no matter what and throw players forward at will.

But yeah, that point annoys me too, but its the way we seem to always play, no matter who we play. In the squad, the only players who seem to press the ball in midfield or up front are Park, Tevez, Fletcher, Anderson and Hargreaves (although Hargreaves has been playing RB recently.)

I do feel that we need to press more and put the opposition under pressure too. That is why I felt we needed Anderson on instead of O'Shea. Not only did O'Shea mean we sat back, but, not only does Anderson press, adds bite to the midfield and challenge to try to win the ball, but he has the abilty to take the ball forward when we do counter. That is why in the CL final I would play a central 3 in midfield of Scholes, Carrick and Anderson with Tevez and Ronaldo supporting Rooney. (I previously wanted Park to play. If we played the Pool I would say Park, but I feel he will be bullied by Chelsea's physical play)

Quick on the counter, plenty of men forward and pressure on the ball. Thats what I think we need to play to beat Chelsea.

P.S Sorry for the misunderstanding.

That's Ok ....I'm often misundertood! It's tough one because you are trying to get the balance between being positive (but not getting caught on the break) but also being smart at the back (but also not inviting pressure and defending too deep). Sven's England to me always seemd to err on the wrong side of inviting pressure. So when United playe like this I worry. One big consideration in this is what players you have at your disposal. Chelsea have deliberately bought players like Makele , essien etc to make themselves hard to beat. United have bought flare players who can beat defences and score goals. This is why they drop points drawing games and we drop them by losing games.

To me , if we have players like , nani , ronaldo , anderson et al then it says to me we should use them effectively . If fergie had planned to win the CL in a negative style then he should have bought some different players. Even Hargreaves (who looks like a defensive buy) seems to be very attack minded these days. Carrick is no Makele.

See less See more

Drew9

· #49 · May 5, 2008

desmondo ... do 1 you meg

desmondo

Discussion Starter · #50 · May 5, 2008

Drew9 said:
desmondo ... do 1 you meg

What? I'm sorry I have no idea what this means

Jazz 16

· #51 · May 5, 2008

desmondo said:
What? I'm sorry I have no idea what this means

Dont mind him

drew-pipe down lad, if you have nothing constructive to say, then dont say
anything at all.

Drew9

· #52 · May 5, 2008

yeah i hear what your saying jazz, but why be negative, every single club in europe wants to be where we are and people are posting threads saying their worried c'mon be a bit positive here whats there to be worried about !!

desmondo

Discussion Starter · #53 · May 5, 2008

Drew9 said:
yeah i hear what your saying jazz, but why be negative, every single club in europe wants to be where we are and people are posting threads saying their worried c'mon be a bit positive here whats there to be worried about !!

Why are you telling me this? Tell this to the team instead. I'm the one who thought they should have gone out at the bridge and had a go at them and see what happened. You talk to me about being positive , but being positive is precisely what I am saying United should be.

Natalie

· #54 · May 5, 2008

worried because wigan don't make it easy for anyone
and at places like blackburn and west ham we only gt a point

Drew9

· #55 · May 5, 2008

well your wrong there cos we lost at west ham actually, and secondly desmondo it's a good point and i agree with you, just the title of the thread annoyed me

we have nothing to fear mate, relaxed football at wigan is what we need im confident we'll do them
i spose the one dissapointing thing about this is that we wont be celebrating it in front of our own fans will we, always dissapoints me like at southampton a few years back and at boro oh well as i said im confident we're going to win the league

appologies dess

41 - 55 of 55 Posts

This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.