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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #1
The stats speak louder than words imo but i'll say what i have to anyway...

i think with making berba our untouchable striker we've certainly lost something - sure hes' got better touches than tevez and rooney but that's about it when it comes to his advantages over them...

if you want passion,interplay betwen the strikers, pace, speed, agility, defending, counter-attacks, impact on every match - they posses all that atributes ahead of berbatov in my own , personal, humble opinion....


last year our greatest strenght was firm approach to derbies with exquisite counterattacking displays...just when our opponenets thought they're about to score one - BOOM - we countered them and scored a goal - whether it was by telepathic understanding (roo-tev - against liverpool ), or some great moves ( saha-evra-ronaldo against arsenal ) , it was irrelevant, we didn't lose...

another problem you'll find if you scratch under the surface ( and that's what i noticed on saturday )is that last season we had tevez- rooney chasing down defenders causing them to give us the ball more often thus reducing the numbers of opposition attacks ... like i said - why repairing when it ain't broken


and that was one of the main reasons why our midfiled was so great..because when having both of 'em invloved you had 2 pit-bulls adding up to our midfield , and not only that our opponents midfileders didn't have the time to think, they even had to ensure there's always at least 1-2 dmf's staying around center circle, not adding to their attack because they were affraid if they lose the ball - the counter would be hitting them like a lightening from the clear sky ...but that was only when we played both roo and tevez up front - and that was in the first part of the season ...making rooney a left winger had something to do with it too because he was sacrifised for the results in big matches - and it worked

fergie's moaning about fixture list but that's just moaning with no sense at all - if you wan't to be on the top of the pile come may - you must be the best and you can achieve that by beating the best only.

i think that our single point of possible 9 against our arch rivals at their soil will have proved out to be as the biggest reason why we won't be standing on the top come the end of season - this means that we have to win the next 20 matches, and we can afford only one loss ( becasue with 27 games lfet to play fergie thinks that 85 points is minimum if you want to be the champion)..and with our departure to this irrelevant world club cup(where we could send youth players to gain some experience ) will have made us drop even further in the table

we will have to make up for those lost points at some other away matches ( tottenham, boro,west ham,city ), and if we fail to win that -then chelsea will be given a great boost to snatch away our title - with the arrival of deco (amasing player - the fact that he's made an immediate impact without having taken time to adapt speaks just how great player he is ) they've become even stronger .not to mention that anelka has been doing what drogba was doing in previous seasons for them ...

also another thing - i think that fletcher would have had something to say in the saturday match - i can tell you one thing - you wouldn't see him letting a midfielder score a brace against us...he would have certainly made his presence felt...

of course - you don't have to agree with me - you can only say - "ahhh, our defence was poor,we've been missing hargo,carrick's jus returned "...and no one could say you're wrong - as usual the truth is something in the middle


oh and another very very ilgoical decision is this - after literary transforming tevez from an in-from performer to a very hard mental condition making him out of form strtiker SAF has done that to rooney now ( of course ,indirectly )---i'm not being a slater but don't you find it a bit strange that when rooney was in top form scoring 9 goals in 7 matches SAF put him to bench,rotated him with Tevez and wayne is now 6 matches without a goal, with berbatov deciding to show up only occasionaly...he did that to tevez to...


he's made berbatov untouchable-sure he has 6 assists to his name but let us not remember that the last 2 were completely down to luck (his shot was stopped by ronaldo and then he hit a great goal, and he simply gave the ball to carrick to hit on the very same position like ronaldo , against Hull ), and that he plays most of the matches i think



anyway - a bit off topic but we witnessed a history last saturday - there you had a united old legend gary naville chasing down nasri who made him look laughable at times, and scoring an own goal eventually - and on the other side with the introducion on rafa we had a player with sliding tackles like dunga ( how everyone failed to put him in their best dmf's list is beyond me ),dribbling skills like robinho and scoed a goal like adriano at his best


and to conclude - we didn't become the european and england champions due to luck - that leads us to the beginning of my thread -you can agree or not but the stats speak louder than words...
 

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*claps*...

Very well said Cro...


I think Tevez should be playing more games, WAY more then what he has done
and Berbatov hasn't impressed me for a full 90 minutes yet. Sure he's got great
skills and that, but all thats useless if you can't do it against the big teams.

He's taken something away from our attack rather then add something IMO. I
thought that hed be a great signing, loft it up to him if we're in trouble and he'd
lay it off, I haven't seen that ONCE this season. Rooney's job is to drop deep and
drive on, Berbatov's cming WAY too deep most of the time. A picky fan would
blame him for Arsenals first goal....


This is probably biased towards Rooney, but I think he should be playing 99% of
our games....probably a very "Rooney Fan" comment, but thats how I feel, I can't
help it.

Tevez and Rooney was a great combination! Have we actually scored any
great "team" goals this season? Remember Boro at home last year, midfield
combo's, Anderson into Rooney, back flick adn Tevez smashes home...



Right now, Berbatov's not worth his 30M to date, I hope he proves me wrong as
the season progresses but to date, no...
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #3
thanks keano-

lol - i think that was my longest post ever !

and still i feel like i haven't said enough :p
 

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thanks keano-

lol - i think that was my longest post ever !

and still i feel like i haven't said enough
I would like to agree with what you siad since i share the same views but i disagree with what want to imply with us not working with berbatov and tevez should play more. If you can imagine a situation where berbatov is playing with ronaldo and rooney and all of them should be attacking then the only thing missing with them is the link up.

With those three playing the best situation would be to have 2 midfielders who can link up midfield to attack and one to mop up or 2 to mop up and one to link them up.

Ronaldo starts from the midfield and is effective in that role while counter attacking but when we start to attack then he plays as a striker roaming all over the place, getting in the box and all that, rooney is also effective in the same role except he does not ghost in the box as ronaldo does. Berbatov is someone who can finish on his own one on one and can create the space for others to finish. Tevez does the same as rooney but the finishing is better and his game is better suited in the oppenent third.

What you have suggested was the way we played last year and if the question is why fix it if not broken then my friend i am sure there was room for improvement to the exploits of last season but as far as filling in the gaps goes i think we have created a few newer ones, ones for which we have not come up with the right answers YET.
 

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I agree completely, last season i thought Rooney and Tevez had to help out because our centre midfield was weak and this season i hoped Hargreaves was going to be one of the first names on the team sheet and be played only in the middle of the park, but its not happened.

Carrick does not stop the opposition and Scholes (the awesome player that he is) isn't renowned for being a great tackler, although he tries his hardest.


CROoney said:
another problem you'll find if you scratch under the surface ( and that's what i noticed on saturday )is that last season we had tevez- rooney chasing down defenders causing them to give us the ball more often thus reducing the numbers of opposition attacks ... like i said - why repairing when it ain't broken

and that was one of the main reasons why our midfiled was so great..because when having both of 'em invloved you had 2 pit-bulls adding up to our midfield ,...
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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11,077 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
shanky said:
I would like to agree with what you siad since i share the same views but i disagree with what want to imply with us not working with berbatov and tevez should play more. If you can imagine a situation where berbatov is playing with ronaldo and rooney and all of them should be attacking then the only thing missing with them is the link up.

With those three playing the best situation would be to have 2 midfielders who can link up midfield to attack and one to mop up or 2 to mop up and one to link them up.

Ronaldo starts from the midfield and is effective in that role while counter attacking but when we start to attack then he plays as a striker roaming all over the place, getting in the box and all that, rooney is also effective in the same role except he does not ghost in the box as ronaldo does. Berbatov is someone who can finish on his own one on one and can create the space for others to finish. Tevez does the same as rooney but the finishing is better and his game is better suited in the oppenent third.

What you have suggested was the way we played last year and if the question is why fix it if not broken then my friend i am sure there was room for improvement to the exploits of last season but as far as filling in the gaps goes i think we have created a few newer ones, ones for which we have not come up with the right answers YET.
shanky,i'm not quite sure what you meant , but as much as i agree that we could have used some improvement ( on the finishing basis), i disagree that berabtov is what we needeed...

don't get me wrong, i'm not blaming HIM for this situation, i'm just blaming the fact that we broke up the best striking duo in the world so unneccessary
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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Discussion Starter #7
tevez my friends, tevez might be the answer...

people uderestimate the job he does for the defence, and strong defence guarantees you trophies....

my aim is not to make this into berba vs tevez thread , but i'm speaking because i spoke with some football related people and they all agreed that he was one of our most important players last season and that he deserves way more playing time
 

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Great post, CROoney.

I enjoyed reading that.

You know the biggest problem with Fergie benching tevez is that whenever he's played in October and November, he's looked TOO eager.

He's been trying too hard and not playing his normal style. He's looked more hurried.
More urgency , but less end product.

I have to say though that you don't give berba enough credit. I like what he brings to the team and he DOES bring calmness and a target upfront.

The players suddenly have someone to aim for upfront and he can control the ball even underpressure. It's not his fault when he's team mates don't give it to him, so he drops back very deep and as Zoran Zlatanov said, apparently he's dropping deep under instruction.

Having seen Berba and his ball control, I simply couldn't do without it anymore.

Eventhough Roonie and Tevez were terriers and helped to defend from infront, Berba can do the same by positioning himself better as opposed to tevez' running and Rooney's still there to harass the opposition.

Think the answer is just some time for the players too gel and play for the team.
 

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Berbatov>Tevez
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11,077 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
RedForceRising said:
Great post, CROoney.

I enjoyed reading that.

You know the biggest problem with Fergie benching tevez is that whenever he's played in October and November, he's looked TOO eager.

He's been trying too hard and not playing his normal style. He's looked more hurried.
More urgency , but less end product.

I have to say though that you don't give berba enough credit. I like what he brings to the team and he DOES bring calmness and a target upfront.

The players suddenly have someone to aim for upfront and he can control the ball even underpressure. It's not his fault when he's team mates don't give it to him, so he drops back very deep and as Zoran Zlatanov said, apparently he's dropping deep under instruction.

Having seen Berba and his ball control, I simply couldn't do without it anymore.

Eventhough Roonie and Tevez were terriers and helped to defend from infront, Berba can do the same by positioning himself better as opposed to tevez' running and Rooney's still there to harass the opposition.

Think the answer is just some time for the players too gel and play for the team.

maybe i don't give him enough credit but that has to do with the fact that he's undeservedly become the untouchable striker....


i admire his touch, i really do (because he's similar to someone i know , who plays in my team ) and it's a small miracale that the player with his pace and lazy attitude can play on a such a high level only because of his remarkable tehnique, but i think roo-tev offer us alot more


cheers
 
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