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Discussion Starter #1
I have followed this club quite closely since i was around 8 or 9.

But there is one thing I do not understand - Why are some fans so opposed to the Glazer family and their affairs with man utd? In my opinion, he has done a fabulous job. For example, we are the richest club in the world, and he has financed the signings of some great additions to the squad. I have not read of any feuds between Fergie and the Glazers, etc.

So, why are fans so angry at the Glazer family? I hear people saying they "hate" the Glazer family... You know, Hitler "hated" the jews. Moreover, I can recall people burning the American flag during the takeover. This just appalled especially because I am American myself.

Anyways, without getting caught up in the political bullsh!t, can you all share some thoughts with me on this matter?
 

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Brock said:
For example, we are the richest club in the world
NOT! We were before they took over, but now so deep in debt they need a JCB to dig us out.

considering all the hullaballoo when they bought United, they keep a low profile now. As it happens things seem to be rolling along smoothly but, when Fergie goes, who knows what will happen because we all know it is HE who runs United now.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Red Devil said:
NOT! We were before they took over, but now so deep in debt they need a JCB to dig us out.

considering all the hullaballoo when they bought United, they keep a low profile now. As it happens things seem to be rolling along smoothly but, when Fergie goes, who knows what will happen because we all know it is HE who runs United now.

Oh, I wasnt quite sure about the money thing. I just remember that article few weeks back.

And when fergie does retire, I hope they will hire someone who is familiar with the club and its functions.
 

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i think it might of been because of the fact that people tought that they were just in it for the money and just forget about what happened on the pitch because they really didnt know much about united and I doubt they knew alot about football, but I think they have done a good job and Id rather have them than hicks and gillet'
 

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Brock said:
I have followed this club quite closely since i was around 8 or 9.

But there is one thing I do not understand - Why are some fans so opposed to the Glazer family and their affairs with man utd? In my opinion, he has done a fabulous job. For example, we are the richest club in the world, and he has financed the signings of some great additions to the squad. I have not read of any feuds between Fergie and the Glazers, etc.

So, why are fans so angry at the Glazer family? I hear people saying they "hate" the Glazer family... You know, Hitler "hated" the jews. Moreover, I can recall people burning the American flag during the takeover. This just appalled especially because I am American myself.

Anyways, without getting caught up in the political bullsh!t, can you all share some thoughts with me on this matter?
Brock, I've decided to not waste my time engaging too much with someone who clearly understands nothing at all about what the Glazer takeover entailed.

However.

It's more than the debt... The heart and soul has been ripped out of the football club, something that many of us grew up loving and worshipping has been changed into something unrecognisable, possibly beyond repair.

It was an act of war, it's as simple as that. And until that war is won, those United fans who do care will do anything and everything to show the bastards from America they're not wanted at OUR football club.

The message is clear Love United - Hate Glazer.
 

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The greedy family is making the fans to pay for their bank loans to fund the overtake of the club. And the Glazer family is NOT generous.
They've been very successful to ruin the Am football club in Tampa. I havent renewed my club membership and wont buy any merchendise as long as the thiefs are owing "my club". I refuse to fund the already wealthy who stole our club.
 

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We're paying for his debts. He's using Manchester United FC as a company to make money from but as long as he provides Fergie with support and doesn't cause trouble like Hicks and Gillette at Pile, then, I've no complaints. Just lower ticket prices a bit!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Yes, I have heard of the increase in ticket prices. That is a shame... I dont know this from experience but I have heard the "real" supporters cant afford a ticket anymore and now OT is filled with business men. That is disappointing.

3-1 United :)
 

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Salford Red showed me this post. Its a good read and might help you understand a bit better:


So the automatic cup scheme was the last straw for me and my Dad, I had been a LMTB/season ticket holder at OT since I was 4, back in the season 1982-83, and experienced my first Wembley final that year. Up until last year I trooped to Old Trafford remembering when I could hear the crowd roar for the big games 3 miles away as I tugged my dad to get to the ground quicker, I remember Whiteside making me the proudest lad in my Bolton school in 1985, I remember once being asked who I support I answered ‘I am Manchester United me’, I remember stopping dead under the tunnel on the last home game of the season in 1993 in awe at the celebrations, so this is what being the champions of England means. I remember idolising Robson and then Cantona and admiring Ole. I remember it all.

No new memories from 2007. I joined in the marches of 2005, sang the chants and waited for the fans to say no more, it never came, most just shrugged their shoulders and said I am alright. That left me disillusioned. I wanted to see Old Trafford empty against Chelsea, but too many where taking their nephew to their first ever game. I wanted to see riots; I wanted to hear Malcolm Glazer had been hanged in a MUFC scarf. I wanted rebellion.

I became a founding member of FC and admired the way they have been set up. But like many I couldn’t give up United, I just vowed league matches only and cancelled my subscription to the voluntary auto cup scheme. I moved to the cheapest seats in the ground and took up extra work to help me pay. I have struggled with my conscious and wish I could say, not one penny like some others. If more did I would have followed, I guess that makes me a sheep of some kind and apart of the problem. But I stuck there supporting the shirts in a selfish way. In the summer of 2007, when prices shot up despite TV money rocketing and being told I have to buy cup tickets despite not being able to attend all midweek games. I could afford it but this was a complete piss take so my Dad and I quit. The decision was right and I wish I had done it in 2005 and then at least I would have a right to take the moral high ground.

My Father and I decided to go and watch FC United instead, our first match was at home against Ossett, The big advantage is that I can take my step son to watch the games and he can actively support a club. On entering the ground I was reminded that in some grounds you still piss on a wall and you can sit where you want. I noticed the flags and felt at home with the Dad and Lad flag. I enjoyed the atmosphere, the singing, the scarf waving and surprisingly the football. We stayed at the end and the players appreciated the support and I felt this was right. My lad now has his half season ticket and we will get to as many games as we can, we have started a list of grounds he has visited, a list he will add to in the years to come.

I feel in the future FC will have to make decisions about the use of commercial money to ensure success, but the difference is, it will be the fans decisions on where the club goes, and as the recent boycott showed I think there is really only one united. I am not sure how I feel about the fans that remain at Old Trafford, I understand their love for the club but I don’t know how they remain blinkered to the rape of the club, and it deserves such a powerful word, maybe they don’t care. Maybe football is just a leisure pursuit and a business, it never used to be. Every goal we conceded used to genuinely hurt me and I would worry all week when we due to play at Anfield.

I still miss Manchester United Football Club, but the odd thing is I would still be missing it if I was still there, because it died sometime and I am unsure when it happened. As Elvis once sang ‘who can tell when summer turns to autumn’.

But there is life after MUFC and it has been reborn in FCUM. The soul is one is an apt name and now I look forward to every game and my children will share that with me. I hope we climb the leagues, I hope we get our own ground and I hope everyone continues to love it. I urge every United fan to come to FC United, come and support a club without profit but with soul, with reason, for hope and for glory.
 

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I am not so sure why people are so upset withe the glazers, i can understand some people problem but all this started when united became a plc putting business before football. The prices where always going to rise and the club was always aming to be a big commercial success, lets not forget before the era of the premier league united where not the big success story alot of people seem to think. Alot of other clubs had won the league and cup's etc a simular amount of times and it is only since the money came into the game that united have come into there own.
People are happy to have it all their own way if you want success off te back of commercial success don't be suprised when it goes further and costs the fans out of their own pocket.
 

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I think the biggest bone of contention is the fact that we went from the richest club in the world WITH NO DEBT to a club only second to Real Madrid in the world now IN DEBT!


On an aside: Liverpool are catching us, fast!
 

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Red Devil said:
I think the biggest bone of contention is the fact that we went from the richest club in the world WITH NO DEBT to a club only second to Real Madrid in the world now IN DEBT!


On an aside: Liverpool are catching us, fast!
Thats the only thing i can understand about people being upset, he is playing a risky game but if united carry on winning they will be able to pay off the debts and still invest in players. The problem may occur if things go wrong on the field.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Jazz 16 said:
Salford Red showed me this post. Its a good read and might help you understand a bit better:


So the automatic cup scheme was the last straw for me and my Dad, I had been a LMTB/season ticket holder at OT since I was 4, back in the season 1982-83, and experienced my first Wembley final that year. Up until last year I trooped to Old Trafford remembering when I could hear the crowd roar for the big games 3 miles away as I tugged my dad to get to the ground quicker, I remember Whiteside making me the proudest lad in my Bolton school in 1985, I remember once being asked who I support I answered ‘I am Manchester United me’, I remember stopping dead under the tunnel on the last home game of the season in 1993 in awe at the celebrations, so this is what being the champions of England means. I remember idolising Robson and then Cantona and admiring Ole. I remember it all.

No new memories from 2007. I joined in the marches of 2005, sang the chants and waited for the fans to say no more, it never came, most just shrugged their shoulders and said I am alright. That left me disillusioned. I wanted to see Old Trafford empty against Chelsea, but too many where taking their nephew to their first ever game. I wanted to see riots; I wanted to hear Malcolm Glazer had been hanged in a MUFC scarf. I wanted rebellion.

I became a founding member of FC and admired the way they have been set up. But like many I couldn’t give up United, I just vowed league matches only and cancelled my subscription to the voluntary auto cup scheme. I moved to the cheapest seats in the ground and took up extra work to help me pay. I have struggled with my conscious and wish I could say, not one penny like some others. If more did I would have followed, I guess that makes me a sheep of some kind and apart of the problem. But I stuck there supporting the shirts in a selfish way. In the summer of 2007, when prices shot up despite TV money rocketing and being told I have to buy cup tickets despite not being able to attend all midweek games. I could afford it but this was a complete piss take so my Dad and I quit. The decision was right and I wish I had done it in 2005 and then at least I would have a right to take the moral high ground.

My Father and I decided to go and watch FC United instead, our first match was at home against Ossett, The big advantage is that I can take my step son to watch the games and he can actively support a club. On entering the ground I was reminded that in some grounds you still piss on a wall and you can sit where you want. I noticed the flags and felt at home with the Dad and Lad flag. I enjoyed the atmosphere, the singing, the scarf waving and surprisingly the football. We stayed at the end and the players appreciated the support and I felt this was right. My lad now has his half season ticket and we will get to as many games as we can, we have started a list of grounds he has visited, a list he will add to in the years to come.

I feel in the future FC will have to make decisions about the use of commercial money to ensure success, but the difference is, it will be the fans decisions on where the club goes, and as the recent boycott showed I think there is really only one united. I am not sure how I feel about the fans that remain at Old Trafford, I understand their love for the club but I don’t know how they remain blinkered to the rape of the club, and it deserves such a powerful word, maybe they don’t care. Maybe football is just a leisure pursuit and a business, it never used to be. Every goal we conceded used to genuinely hurt me and I would worry all week when we due to play at Anfield.

I still miss Manchester United Football Club, but the odd thing is I would still be missing it if I was still there, because it died sometime and I am unsure when it happened. As Elvis once sang ‘who can tell when summer turns to autumn’.

But there is life after MUFC and it has been reborn in FCUM. The soul is one is an apt name and now I look forward to every game and my children will share that with me. I hope we climb the leagues, I hope we get our own ground and I hope everyone continues to love it. I urge every United fan to come to FC United, come and support a club without profit but with soul, with reason, for hope and for glory.
Thanks mate. I can understand that view entirely now. Its hard living here in the states and trying to follow foreign teams. Sports are secondary here... We use it to relax and for something to do.

When I went over to the U.K last summer, I went to some of the preseason games - Charlton athletic against the new zealand national team. I recall sitting in the cheering section with my mates and it was incredible. Anytime the new zealand fans began to sing, all the the Charlton fans would stand and sing, "Sit down, Shut up" It was awesome. I loved the passion in only a preseason game.

Football over there, and everywhere else but here, seems to view football as a number one priority. And when something like the Glazer family does something to ruin that tradition for someone like you jazz, its really heartbreaking.
 

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Brock said:
. And when something like the Glazer family does something to ruin that tradition for someone like you jazz, its really heartbreaking.
You misunderstood mate.
Thats not me in the post. Its an example of how many are feeling and what is happening to the average match going fan. Sal showed me the post. maybe he knows the guy.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Jazz 16 said:
You misunderstood mate.
Thats not me in the post. Its an example of how many are feeling and what is happening to the average match going fan. Sal showed me the post. maybe he knows the guy.
Oh :p It was a long night.
 
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Think this article in todays Telegraph explains very well.


American dream spells nightmare for Liverpool

By Nick Towle, guest columnist
Last Updated: 3:45am GMT 27/01/2008

The concerns that Liverpool fans are currently experiencing will strike a chord with the Manchester United supporters who resented their club falling into the hands of American owners three years ago.

When the Glazers took over at Old Trafford, I decided I would not be renewing my season ticket because I felt it wasn't my club any more and I have not been back.

At the time it was a very difficult step to take because United had been my club and any committed football fan knows what that means. But, like so many others, I didn't like what was happening and feared for the future.

We could all see that the Glazers weren't football fans and that they were taking out huge loans to secure the deal. From being a club with no debt, United were suddenly a club with heavy debts.

The cost was bound to be passed on to the supporters and that has proved to be the case. The price of the season ticket I had has more than doubled in the three seasons since I gave it up.

The Liverpool takeover was greeted very differently. There was a great fanfare for Tom Hicks and George Gillett, who made very public appearances, gave lots of interviews and made all the right noises. They gave the impression their regime would be nothing like the Glazers' and most Liverpool fans fell for the charm offensive.

We were approached by some Liverpool supporters and we cautioned them not to take everything at face value. Now, more and more Liverpool fans realise that the big PR front was exactly that. It seems they have the same way of doing things as the Glazers after all.

If anything, I think Liverpool are probably going to be in bigger debt that United. The refinancing deal and the new stadium could put them in even more trouble than the Glazers have inflicted on Old Trafford.

Far from benefiting from the investment of American money, Liverpool are likely to find themselves funding Hicks' baseball and ice hockey teams across the Atlantic. He has openly admitted as much. The fans want to see money coming into their football club, not going out of it.

The fact is that Liverpool are being treated like a franchise. That's the way of it in the US but it's not the way we regard our football clubs over here.

The Americans don't understand the game in England and everything about it - the fans, the traditions and what a football club means. Even a club like United, with a global following, has always been a community club.

This is not just a problem for United and Liverpool. It's a bad and dangerous situation for English football in general. The game here will eventually suffer because the loyal lifelong fans will be priced out of their clubs.

I don't have any pangs of regret about staying away from Old Trafford now because I see what a money-fixated club it has become. It's all about profit, profit, profit.

Sadly, that's the way football is going and I feel sorry for the game. It's going to get worse. Fans are being asked to dig deeper into their pockets to feed this commercial machine. It's becoming crazy.

I keep in touch with what's happening at United and I watch the matches on television, so to that extent I still feed the machine. But I don't have to fork out more than £1,000 a year to watch them.

The ticket prices have soared, just as we predicted, and this season we've seen the ludicrous automatic cup ticket scheme in operation at United.

Whether season ticket holders like it or not, they have had to buy a ticket for every home cup match as well. That included the Carling Cup tie against Coventry City, when United put out a reserve team. The club botched it up badly this season and they now realise that, so I am sure there will be changes for next season.

United are telling everyone how they plan to commemorate the 50th anniversary of the Munich air crash on Feb 6 and pay further tribute to those who died when they play Manchester City at Old Trafford on Feb 10.

They say there will be no commercialism and have produced a one-off Fifties-style shirt for the occasion without the sponsor's name. We understand there will, however, be an AIG logo on display with the picture panels of the new Munich Tunnel, which depicts the story of the Busby Babes and Matt Busby's rebuilding of the team after the tragedy.

That has, to say the least, not gone down well with United fans, but then it is a reflection of the route the club have taken. People may wonder why we complain and continue to campaign for the genuine fan. United are having another successful season, playing attacking, attractive football and Old Trafford is full to its 76,000 capacity. But many of the true fans no longer go and what will happen if United have a dip in fortune? Will they still turn up in such numbers to feed the commercial machine and pay off the interest on the club's debts?

More fans will be driven away and be restricted to watching their football on television. I'm currently in Sierra Leone on business and the Premier League is enormously popular here. It gives you an insight into the global appeal of English football.

But live football is getting out of reach for the traditional English football fan and I believe that is a trend that should sadden all of us.

• Nick Towle is the chairman of the Manchester United Supporters' Trust (MUST), formerly Shareholders United. He has asked for the fee for this article to be donated to the George Best Foundation.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml;jsessionid=152OTSOPE1FBDQFIQMFSFF4AVCBQ0IV0?xml=/sport/2008/01/27/sfngue127.xml
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I think the picture of the Babes on display at OT represents this whole ordeal. The AIG symbol is on the picture and the fans wanted it taken off if im not mistaken. But the Glazer's insisted it be up :rolleyes:
 

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the problem is that they have stuck their own debt against our club ... still if they ontinue to back us by buying quality like anderson tevez and hargo then who's going to complain :)
 
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